£1.0 Trillion To Fund Public Sector Pension Liability

[taxman]

The 85 rule is used frequently in the Public Sector to enhance retirement benefits and get rid of slackers. You don't appear to appreciate that you were able to retire and receive a pension unlike many Private Sector workers who will get next to nothing.

 

Where do you get your information from?

Private sector workers can get a pension if they want one - its called a stakeholder pension but take up is minimal. I will retire and receive a pension. Correct, bizzarely however you seem to be under the impression this will be tax free. It won't be. My pension is predicted to be £4238 per year based on me retiring at 65 years old. Well sorry for bankrupting the country!!

 

Taxman sums up the peception that the Public Sector has of the Private Sector in that any employee in the Private Sector earning good money should be taxed at a 70% rate because they lazy. There wouldn't be any Public Sector if there wasn't a Private Sector to pay for it out of taxation on new money.

 

I was being sarcastic. I was pointing out that the view of the Daily Mail and people like you that the public sector do naff all then retire to their mansions was about as stupid as my assertion that the private sector are all tax avoiding scumbags.

 

It appears that the Public Sector both expects and demands that the Private Sector continues to pay its wages and fund its pensions whilst it couldn't care less about the Private Sectors working conditions and pension arrangements. I wondered how many Public Sector employees are paid The National Minimum Wage, how about none?

 

The private sector does not pay my wages. My wages are paid from the proceeds of general direct and indirect taxes. Tax that I help to collect from public sector workers as well as private sector workers and companies. Prey, tell me how we don't care about private sector pay and working conditions. If it wasn't for the public sector workers on the National Minimum Wage team then the conditions for these workers would be worse than they are.

Finally, although I don't have the figures to hand I expect there are loads of public sector workers, cleaners, admin staff, canteen staff,etc etc who are on minimum wage. I myself was eligible for working tax credits when I joined the Revenue, so low were my wages. But I'm not complaining. If I want a job in the Private Sector I'll get one. I wonder why you don't become a public sector worker if it's all so easy and full of rich pickings.

[taxman]

Tell you what lets all agree.

 

There are an awfully lot of poor private sector workers and others who are fat cats and are coining it in.

 

There are an awfully lot of poor public sector workers and others who are fat bureaucrats with their Knighthoods who are coining it in.

 

Come the revolution...........we have nothing to lose but our chains.........so comrades come rally and the last fight let us face........etc...etc

[crookesey]

The private sector does not pay my wages. My wages are paid from the proceeds of general direct and indirect taxes. Tax that I help to collect from public sector workers as well as private sector workers and companies. Prey, tell me how we don't care about private sector pay and working conditions. If it wasn't for the public sector workers on the National Minimum Wage team then the conditions for these workers would be worse than they are.

Finally, although I don't have the figures to hand I expect there are loads of public sector workers, cleaners, admin staff, canteen staff,etc etc who are on minimum wage. I myself was eligible for working tax credits when I joined the Revenue, so low were my wages. But I'm not complaining. If I want a job in the Private Sector I'll get one. I wonder why you don't become a public sector worker if it's all so easy and full of rich pickings.

 

Because I would not fit into a system where it's employees don't understand simple economics.

 

Take out all Private Sector taxation and there would be no taxation from the Public sector because it wouldn't exist. Are you unable to grasp the concept of the importance of new money against taxed money? Probably not based on your left wing rant regarding taxing well paid Private Sector workers at 70%, someone with your peception of the Private Sector would find it difficult to get beyond the interview stage let alone secure a position in it.

 

I was under the impression (please correct me if I am wrong) that most of the low paid jobs that you mention were contracted out to the Private Sector years ago.

 

My thread was by way of a question asking how Private Sector retirement provision will be provided in the future, any ideas?

[taxman]

Because I would not fit into a system where it's employees don't understand simple ecomomics.

 

Take out all Private Sector taxation and there would be no taxation from the Public sector because it wouldn't exist. Are you unable to grasp the concept of the importance of new money against taxed money? Probably not based on your left wing rant regarding taxing well paid Private Sector workers at 70%, someone with your peception of the Private Sector would find it difficult to get beyond the interview stage let alone secure a position in it.

 

As I already stated I was being sarcastic. Let me talk slowly. Wild generalisations about the public sector are just as invalid as wild generalisations about the private sector. OK? Got that?

 

I was under the impression (please correct me if I am wrong) that most of the low paid jobs that you mention were contracted out to the Private Sector years ago.

 

No there are loads of low paid public sector jobs

 

My thread was by way of a question asking how Private Sector retirement provision will be provided in the future, any ideas?

 

Many private companies I visit have extremely good pension schemes, but mainly for the Directors. Like I said there are rich and poor in both in both sectors.

 

 

Now I've got public service to get on with thanks.

[extaxman]

I am reluctant to persue this pointless argument much further but feel that I must point out that there is a line missing from Tony's original posting.

 

His posting now reads:-

 

"IMO there is 1 basic problem with the UK economy.

 

A third of workers are public sector.

 

*ducks for cover as the civil servants and charity workers rally*"

 

Originally there was another line reading:-

 

"and public sector workers produce nothing but costs"

 

that is the line I objected to, presumably Tony realised how foolish it was.

 

Anyway let's draw a line under this subject, nobody's going to argree or change any one elses opinion.

[Tony]

I edited it (like anyone can) because I had second thoughts about what it would contribute apart from lighting a blue touch paper. I didn't and still don't think it's 'foolish' but I did think that it would be taken out of the context I wrote it in - like you did.

 

You were just a bit too quick off the mark with your response which you posted while I was editing.

 

Many public sector workers produce very little if anything to directly contribute to the economy, but they do rack up costs.

 

Regardless, the private sector (rather predictably) finds itself having to prop up an over sized public sector... yet again!

[Longcol]

It's the Keynesian multiplier Joe.

 

Much of what people in the public sector earn will be spent on goods & services in the private sector which will go on taxes which will employ people in the public sector....

 

I know it's a bit of a chicken and egg situation as to what comes first but the two generally have symbiotic relationship. Do you think the regeneration of Sheffield would have been anything like as quick without government money...and the recession of the '80's would have been much deeper without the public sector.

 

However I do have concerns about the sheer volume of public sector jobs that aren't providing a service to the public - especially the growth of the "regulators".

[crookesey]

My original point was based on a two tear pension system, so how about this?

 

The government have been lambasted by the Financial Services Ombudsman for Gordon Brown's £5.0 billon per annum raid on private pensions. Also the Ombudsman is critical of the abysmal compensation for former members of wound up Private Sector final salary schemes.

 

Today a spokesperson stated that it was the responsibility of the scheme member prior to joining to accertain if membership was beneficial and that the scheme was in good order. It was also stated that prospective members should not have relied on the content of the scheme booklet and should have seeked independent financial advice.

 

What the hell has independent financial advice got to do with joining your firms final salary scheme? The member would have a meeting with the personel officer who would have explained the basis of the scheme and a decision would have been made accordingly.

 

Now if the member had seen an independent financial adviser and been advised wrongly to forego the benefits of the company scheme and start a personal pension then they would probably have been awarded compensaion for a miss sell.

 

If they had been advised correctly to take advantage of the company benefits on offer for very little cost to themselves then the advisor could now be held responsible for the loss incurred due to the failure of the scheme.

 

It appears that the Ombudsman's decision is final, unless of course he finds against the government.

[le-joker]

Why blame the guy next door who happens to work for the council for the pension time bomb.

All he did was sign up for a job and compulsarily pay into his employers pension scheme.

Blame the people who agreed this pension system, that is local government management.

All public employees just want what is possible from their contributions.