sheff1johnny Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 "“The money being saved is so little. The four councils together pay £329,000 to Northern Rail for this concession and around 250,000 people have these passes. For less than £2 a head they provide free travel for some of the most vulnerable people in society." Why don't the pensioners just pay the £2 a head..free travel saved for very little cost or have I mis-understood..? They are willing too, Northern and SYPTE will not let them, that's what there protesting about. Here's a picture of the protest at Pensitone, hope it worked. SYPTE is insisting on making all pensioners and disabled people paying full fare, no exceptions. No discount, no anything. This will also impact on busses, making them more full, as people will be forced onto busses. Why they didn't just stop travel into West Yorkshire, and save a bit of money that way is beyond me. Instead they stopped the free bus, took away free travel from Pensioners, made disabled people not be disabled before 9.30 or after 10.30. Most disabled people I know are disabled 24 hours a day. The argument is that they can't charge anyone a fare with a disabled pass, so instead they have to act as though they don't have a pass. Derbyshire gets round it by selling a wayfarer at half price, to concessionary pass holders. Why can't we have something like that here? http://s100.photobucket.com/user/sheff1johnny/media/temporary_zps1c519146.jpg.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plain Talker Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 The money used to subsidise free travel on trains for ENCTS (age concession) has been withdrawn. In the short term to protect children's and scholars fares and in the long term to protect bus services on Sundays, early and late and rural services. The agreement with Northern will also lapse and would need to be renegotiated as their franchise ends/renewed/extended. The funding was paid for by South Yorkshire residents out of their Council Tax. ENCTS was introduced to provide a more vulnerable age group with access to local services. Some people used it to travel further afield. Politicians through SYPTE extended this to local train travel and found that Northern were willing participants as new stations were opened and some rolling stock purchased and they did not have to pay for them. Some of these stations served South Yorkshire residents but were located in West Yorkshire eg Moorthorpe. Agreements were extended with WYPTE and Northern regarding the relatively small subsidy given to Northern. As neither WYPTE or SYPTE can sustain the investment, Northern and its successor will seek substantial increases to uphold this loss of revenue. So a group of ENCTS pass holders who have benefited from free travel for a few years want to defend their freebie. They appear unaware of the cost impact on other pensioners who are not entitled to an ENCTS pass until they are over 66. They appear unaware of the cost and amenity impact on all public transport users who will lose their services. They appear unaware of the cost impact on families with young children. They appear unaware of the cost impact on scholars who are to lose their subsidy anyway. They appear unaware of the cost impact on families on low income. They appear unaware of the cost impact on workers who need services to get to work outside the normal working week. How ironic it would be if an ENCTS pass holder regained their subsidised shopping trip to Leeds on the train but lost their ability to get to their station because the bus service was withdrawn. Once again many thanks for that comprehensive information. It has certainly helped me to understand matters a lot more clearly. What really happened was, that the choices that were given were (Correct me if I have left one out) 1) take away concessions for the disabled and elderly 2) take away the concessions for children's fares 3) remove tendered services or 4) remove rural services. Now, * oddly enough, cough, cough*, all of those choices represent people at the sh.. I mean *cough* the sharp end of the stick. Not those at the top of the ladder making the big bucks. (hmm! *thinks*...) What this amounted to was, metaphorically speaking, that four kittens were held up before us, and we were asked which of these is the kitten we should drown. we can't cut children's concessions, as the kids need to get their education. We can't cut tendered services, or rural, as those who are isolated will become even more so. As I and others said, here and in other threads, there could have been something put in place like west Yorkshire and Derbyshire have, half-price fares or half- price waysaver (whatever they are called) tickets. ---------- Post added 02-05-2014 at 17:28 ---------- The other thing was that the impact assessment was not carried out about the effect that these restrictions would have, on the quality of life of the disabled pass-holders and the pensioners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotusflower Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 What really happened was, that the choices that were given were (Correct me if I have left one out) 1) take away concessions for the disabled and elderly 2) take away the concessions for children's fares 3) remove tendered services or 4) remove rural services. Now, * oddly enough, cough, cough*, all of those choices represent people at the sh.. I mean *cough* the sharp end of the stick. Not those at the top of the ladder making the big bucks. (hmm! *thinks*...) What this amounted to was, metaphorically speaking, that four kittens were held up before us, and we were asked which of these is the kitten we should drown. we can't cut children's concessions, as the kids need to get their education. We can't cut tendered services, or rural, as those who are isolated will become even more so. As I and others said, here and in other threads, there could have been something put in place like west Yorkshire and Derbyshire have, half-price fares or half- price waysaver (whatever they are called) tickets. ---------- Post added 02-05-2014 at 17:28 ---------- The other thing was that the impact assessment was not carried out about the effect that these restrictions would have, on the quality of life of the disabled pass-holders and the pensioners. Hiya Plain Talker, I do believe you and I are singing from the same hymn sheet pretty much. Having just trawled through the thread again it's obvious that the old tactic of divide and rule is working as well as ever! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 Now, * oddly enough, cough, cough*, all of those choices represent people at the sh.. I mean *cough* the sharp end of the stick. Not those at the top of the ladder making the big bucks. (hmm! *thinks*...) To be fair PT, those as the top of the ladder making the big bucks probably don't make a great deal of use of the local buses and certainly won't have free passes (unless they are also disabled or of pensionable age of course). So it would have been quite difficult for SYPTE to make changes that would affect them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheff1johnny Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 Free train travel withdrawn for pensioners, whilst: From 30 March, new GetAbout Day and GetAbout 7 Day tickets will offer young people with valid MegaTravel, MegaTravel MiCard and 16-18 Student Passes unlimited bus and tram travel in South Yorkshire at the introductory price of just £2.50 a day or £6.50 a week. A new GetAbout+ Day ticket, available from 18 May, will also offer a day’s unlimited county-wide travel on bus, tram and train for just £3.60. TravelMaster GetAbout Day, GetAbout 7 Day and GetAbout+ Day tickets will be available to buy on First, Stagecoach, TM Travel and Sheffield Community Transport buses or Supertram services. GetAbout+ Day tickets will also be available from staffed rail ticket offices. Why can't pensioners, and mobility pass holders have these? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willman Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 Free train travel withdrawn for pensioners, whilst: From 30 March, new GetAbout Day and GetAbout 7 Day tickets will offer young people with valid MegaTravel, MegaTravel MiCard and 16-18 Student Passes unlimited bus and tram travel in South Yorkshire at the introductory price of just £2.50 a day or £6.50 a week. A new GetAbout+ Day ticket, available from 18 May, will also offer a day’s unlimited county-wide travel on bus, tram and train for just £3.60. TravelMaster GetAbout Day, GetAbout 7 Day and GetAbout+ Day tickets will be available to buy on First, Stagecoach, TM Travel and Sheffield Community Transport buses or Supertram services. GetAbout+ Day tickets will also be available from staffed rail ticket offices. Why can't pensioners, and mobility pass holders have these? Perhaps because the people its being offered too actually need it. Pensioners don't need cheap travel at peak times - and the above passes probably have no restrictions on them. ---------- Post added 08-05-2014 at 15:00 ---------- What really happened was, that the choices that were given were (Correct me if I have left one out) 1) take away concessions for the disabled and elderly 2) take away the concessions for children's fares 3) remove tendered services or 4) remove rural services. Now, * oddly enough, cough, cough*, all of those choices represent people at the sh.. I mean *cough* the sharp end of the stick. Not those at the top of the ladder making the big bucks. (hmm! *thinks*...) What this amounted to was, metaphorically speaking, that four kittens were held up before us, and we were asked which of these is the kitten we should drown. we can't cut children's concessions, as the kids need to get their education. We can't cut tendered services, or rural, as those who are isolated will become even more so. As I and others said, here and in other threads, there could have been something put in place like west Yorkshire and Derbyshire have, half-price fares or half- price waysaver (whatever they are called) tickets. ---------- Post added 02-05-2014 at 17:28 ---------- The other thing was that the impact assessment was not carried out about the effect that these restrictions would have, on the quality of life of the disabled pass-holders and the pensioners. What impact to quality of life does losing a free train to Leeds have on anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotusflower Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 Perhaps because the people its being offered too actually need it. Pensioners don't need cheap travel at peak times - and the above passes probably have no restrictions on them. ---------- Post added 08-05-2014 at 15:00 ---------- What impact to quality of life does losing a free train to Leeds have on anyone? Misinformed and narrow minded is how I view those replies. Do you know the individual circumstances of EVERY pensioner? The quality of a lot of pensioner's lives is restricted by the withdrawal of free rail travel within South Yorkshire and to and from West Yorkshire from South Yorkshire. It places restrictions on their freedom of choice during their retirement. I'm fully aware that buses are still free after 9.30am but bus travel is much slower and therefore time consuming. Please explain how and why you conceive of 11pm being "peak time." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willman Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 Misinformed and narrow minded is how I view those replies. Do you know the individual circumstances of EVERY pensioner? The quality of a lot of pensioner's lives is restricted by the withdrawal of free rail travel within South Yorkshire and to and from West Yorkshire from South Yorkshire. It places restrictions on their freedom of choice during their retirement. I'm fully aware that buses are still free after 9.30am but bus travel is much slower and therefore time consuming. Please explain how and why you conceive of 11pm being "peak time." I'm afraid i'm as informed as you are. Do you know everyones circumstances NO, yet we have to play to the minority yet again. I've heard loads of folks visiting family for free etc - my family live in Cornwall do i get a free train pass when i hit OAP status? The ones who love their families catch the bus. There are no restrictions on freedom spend your free time catching a free bus. If you want choice then pay for it,like the rest of the unemployed have to. Most ,not all oap's don't have jobs so they have all the time in the world to do their chores. I didn't concieve peak times, but i'm sure once upon a time 11pm could have been peak for the late workers and drinkers. However i do know that pre 9.30a.m is ludicrous, just like queueing a the post office at lunch time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotusflower Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 I'm afraid i'm as informed as you are. Do you know everyones circumstances NO, yet we have to play to the minority yet again. I've heard loads of folks visiting family for free etc - my family live in Cornwall do i get a free train pass when i hit OAP status? The ones who love their families catch the bus. There are no restrictions on freedom spend your free time catching a free bus. If you want choice then pay for it,like the rest of the unemployed have to. Most ,not all oap's don't have jobs so they have all the time in the world to do their chores. I didn't concieve peak times, but i'm sure once upon a time 11pm could have been peak for the late workers and drinkers. However i do know that pre 9.30a.m is ludicrous, just like queueing a the post office at lunch time. So...if I'm understanding you correctly you are whinging because someone else is, or was, getting something you were not? "Once upon a time" is the stuff of Hans Christian Anderson. An 11pm deadline for free bus passes effectively means a curfew for the poorer pensioner...FACT! Pensioners are NOT unemployed...they are RETIRED! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willman Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 So...if I'm understanding you correctly you are whinging because someone else is, or was, getting something you were not? "Once upon a time" is the stuff of Hans Christian Anderson. An 11pm deadline for free bus passes effectively means a curfew for the poorer pensioner...FACT! Pensioners are NOT unemployed...they are RETIRED! I'm not whinging about anything - its an opinion based on observations. A small minority of people were granted something no one else was getting, now they are having to get used to reality and they don't like it. Where's the community spirit, spend you money locally not in West Yorkshire. You are correct pensioners are unemployed so they have more money in most cases, perhaps if we introduce free buses on production of a JSA form. Nothing in the current concessions is a restriction on a pensioner from doing anything - so it isn't a fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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