The Conservative Party - all discussion here please.

[Flanker7]

Mecky, . . . . . . "No employer in the world would pay their staff if they thought they could get away with it", is a statement so stupid it defies a response. You seem to argue for slavery.

. . . . . . . . .

 

Clever spinning Alan.

 

What Mecky is saying is that all employers are out for themselves with no though for anyone else. He is not for slavery but against employers.

 

This is a direct contradiction of the way you portray your treatment of employee's.

 

I ask Mecky what he would do if he was an employer.

And - 'not be an employer' - won't wash.

[Mecky]

Clever spinning Alan.

 

What Mecky is saying is that all employers are out for themselves with no though for anyone else. He is not for slavery but against employers.

 

This is a direct contradiction of the way you portray your treatment of employee's.

 

I ask Mecky what he would do if he was an employer.

And - 'not be an employer' - won't wash.

 

It depends on the size of the organisation and how big your profit margins are, which is a balancing act I admit, but when businesses post net profits of around £3bn, that's just obscene. Especially if they're trying to avoid taxation which I suspect most large businesses are. That's only part of the problem though. In the UK employees are treat much worse than is many European countries, which is set to get worse if the "OUT" brigade get their way and human rights are abolished. There is no harmonious working in the UK as there is in Germany or Denmark, for example.

[Frederick1]

John Lewis, Waitrose, Nissan, Toyota, Debenhams, not forgetting;-

 

ME. I don't expect anyone to work here who doesn't enjoy coming to work. In order to enjoy it people have to be appropriately remunerated, trained respected and motivated.

 

This is not because I am a nice guy, although clearly I am, it is just basic commercial sense. If people are happy they don't look round for another job, they regard the company as their own. I have had people working here for over 30years a number over 25/20/15/10/etc.

 

I feel a bit sorry for you, and the bruvvers, it must be awful doing something you hate. Why have you let yourself fall into that trap?

 

Quite right Alan! I've worked for firms paying a "decent" salary, and also unfortunately for ones who don't! I know which I preferred working for so didn't look seriously for another job until they started screwing me!

 

:)

[Alan Ladd]

Clever spinning Alan.

 

What Mecky is saying is that all employers are out for themselves with no though for anyone else. He is not for slavery but against employers.

 

This is a direct contradiction of the way you portray your treatment of employee's.

 

I ask Mecky what he would do if he was an employer.

And - 'not be an employer' - won't wash.

 

I did not intend to "spin" in any way. Notwithstanding that I look forward to meckys response.

 

---------- Post added 07-10-2014 at 14:44 ----------

 

It depends on the size of the organisation and how big your profit margins are, which is a balancing act I admit, but when businesses post net profits of around £3bn, that's just obscene. Especially if they're trying to avoid taxation which I suspect most large businesses are. That's only part of the problem though. In the UK employees are treat much worse than is many European countries, which is set to get worse if the "OUT" brigade get their way and human rights are abolished. There is no harmonious working in the UK as there is in Germany or Denmark, for example.

 

Most big firms are international. If you were running one would you base your HQ in the country where you pay most tax? Of course you would not. It makes no sense to have national HQs therefore it is up to politicians to harmonize taxes. If they did that would effectively work against the UK as we would no longer attract inward investment.

 

So what do you want? What is your remedy? A system where big companies would withdraw their business bases from the UK with the resultant job losses or the present system where the UK is increasingly seen as a place where big companies can invest and grow creating employment.

 

Please enlighten me.

[Mecky]

I did not intend to "spin" in any way. Notwithstanding that I look forward to meckys response.

 

---------- Post added 07-10-2014 at 14:44 ----------

 

 

Most big firms are international. If you were running one would you base your HQ in the country where you pay most tax? Of course you would not. It makes no sense to have national HQs therefore it is up to politicians to harmonize taxes. If they did that would effectively work against the UK as we would no longer attract inward investment.

 

So what do you want? What is your remedy? A system where big companies would withdraw their business bases from the UK with the resultant job losses or the present system where the UK is increasingly seen as a place where big companies can invest and grow creating employment.

 

Please enlighten me.

 

Serious question: Are you on drugs? It appears to be affecting your judgement and jumping the gun.

[Flanker7]

Oh dear Mecky - you didn't answer the question and you lost it in your last post. What would you do?

 

I'll have a go - Multi-National companies hold no loyalty to any country. I would not expect them to pick a country that places them at a disadvantage vis-a-vis somewhere else. Profit motive is all they care about. But, the job of Government is to look after its citizens and, at least, tax the multi-nationals in accordance with the tax regime suffered by the people in that country. They are here because we are a developed country with a literate, sophisticated work force. The reason we have a literate, sophisticated work force is because we tax our citizens in order to educate our children and its not cheap. Why should we let the Multi-nationals rip us off for their profits?

 

I wish more employers were like Alan Ladd, who realise that if you treat people decently, respect them and give them a decent wage they will perform better for everyone. I'm sure he's not saying we should let the multi-national's ride on our backs because if we don't they will go somewhere else and exploit someone else. . is he?

 

By the way Alan, thanks for the cocked eyed admission that you did 'spin' ;0)

[Mecky]

Oh dear Mecky - you didn't answer the question and you lost it in your last post. What would you do?

 

I'll have a go - Multi-National companies hold no loyalty to any country. I would not expect them to pick a country that places them at a disadvantage vis-a-vis somewhere else. Profit motive is all they care about. But, the job of Government is to look after its citizens and, at least, tax the multi-nationals in accordance with the tax regime suffered by the people in that country. They are here because we are a developed country with a literate, sophisticated work force. The reason we have a literate, sophisticated work force is because we tax our citizens in order to educate our children and its not cheap. Why should we let the Multi-nationals rip us off for their profits?

 

I wish more employers were like Alan Ladd, who realise that if you treat people decently, respect them and give them a decent wage they will perform better for everyone. I'm sure he's not saying we should let the multi-national's ride on our backs because if we don't they will go somewhere else and exploit someone else. . is he?

 

By the way Alan, thanks for the cocked eyed admission that you did 'spin' ;0)

 

It wasn't a serious question he asked but a digression, or if you like another angle of attack since he's lost all of his previous arguments. Nor do I think he's an employer let alone a good one, but the way he rattles off his brash rhetric he has to be on something.

 

Anyway, what I'd like to see are businesses paying their full whack of tax. Even if they're not based in the UK they should pay the full amount on their UK takings and preferably on turnover not pre-tax profit.

 

ps. If if the job of the government is to look after its citizens why do they want to get rid of the ECHR, why are they persecuting the unemployed, the disabled, council tenants, the elderly, civil servants, the army, the police etc?

[L00b]

Nor do I think he's an employer let alone a good one, but the way he rattles off his brash rhetric he has to be on something.

Whether he's making it up or not, the points Alan has made about the performance and retention of workforce are entirely valid, proven through the ages by the likes of M&S, John Lewis etc. (in this country, there are countless others elsewhere) and have been acknowledged by HR academia for decades.

Anyway, what I'd like to see are businesses paying their full whack of tax.

Most UK businesses (which consist of SMEs) do. We certainly do.

Even if they're not based in the UK they should pay the full amount on their UK takings and preferably on turnover not pre-tax profit.

Shows the extent of your understanding of basic economics. Jayyysus.

[Frederick1]

ps. If if the job of the government is to look after its citizens why do they want to get rid of the ECHR, why are they persecuting the unemployed, the disabled, council tenants, the elderly, civil servants, the army, the police etc?

 

'Cos criminals use it to "hide behind"?

I'm not against "Human Rights" but the European version is way over the top.

:)

[Mecky]

'Cos criminals use it to "hide behind"?

I'm not against "Human Rights" but the European version is way over the top.

:)

 

and what will you say when you suddenly find you need them as the UK falls further into dictatorship?

 

---------- Post added 08-10-2014 at 10:09 ----------

 

Whether he's making it up or not, the points Alan has made about the performance and retention of workforce are entirely valid, proven through the ages by the likes of M&S, John Lewis etc. (in this country, there are countless others elsewhere) and have been acknowledged by HR academia for decades.

Most UK businesses (which consist of SMEs) do. We certainly do.

Shows the extent of your understanding of basic economics. Jayyysus.

 

Bang!! There's the gun, hey wait for me ...