The Labour Party. All discussion here please

[andyofborg]

Meanwhile st jezza has said he doesn't want a people's vote now, but he might want one later.

 

Brilliant.

 

like the ERG, Labour doesn't have an alternative offering only fantasies which dont stand scrutiny in the cold light of day.

 

which is why he, shami chakrabarti and the mp for hemsworth did so poorly on tv shows today.

[Top Cats Hat]

 

Seemingly doing a good job of spinning himself into knots.

 

 

You have the May loyalists like Amber Rudd on one hand and on the other you have the lunatic Rees-Mogg fringe. In the the middle is a large number of Tory MPs who really don't know which way to jump.

 

At the moment the Brextremists seem to have shown their hand too early and have been exposed as not having the support they have been claiming so the 'neutrals' are doing their best to appear loyal but not too convincingly.

[sheffbag]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-england-leeds-46236182?ns_mchannel=social&ns_source=twitter&ns_campaign=bbc_live&ns_linkname=5bf272b02d48630667fe8d8f%26MP 'not going anywhere' despite no confidence vote%262018-11-19T09%3A53%3A39.343Z&ns_fee=0&pinned_post_locator=urn:asset:aeea582b-4ca2-46d9-8611-e9af24af0e4b&pinned_post_asset_id=5bf272b02d48630667fe8d8f&pinned_post_type=share

https://labourlist.org/2018/11/angela-smith-loses-no-confidence-vote-by-local-party/

Another example of "dont criticise Jeremy or we'll throw you out". A good MP for 13 years but seemingly disagreeing with lord Jez of Corbynbville gets you potentially out of a job. its a tight majority up there as well

ah just seen this has its own thread

[AlexAtkin]

That's how democracy is SUPPOSED to work!  The members voted for Corbyn and his policies, so yes MPs that undermine him SHOULD be kicked out.  There's a BIG difference between constructive criticism and undermining the leader btw, nobody should be thrown out for the former.

Refusing to leave after a no confidence vote is undemocratic, plain and simple.  That alone contradicts your claim of her being "a good MP".

Honestly, people moan about SCC making a mess of things and then when the party tries to get rid of the sort of people who caused it, they complain about that too.  There is no pleasing some people.

Edited November 20, 2018 by AlexAtkin

[truman]

40 minutes ago, AlexAtkin said:

That's how democracy is SUPPOSED to work!  The members voted for Corbyn and his policies, so yes MPs that undermine him SHOULD be kicked out.  There's a BIG difference between constructive criticism and undermining the leader btw, nobody should be thrown out for the former.

Refusing to leave after a no confidence vote is undemocratic, plain and simple.  That alone contradicts your claim of her being "a good MP".

Honestly, people moan about SCC making a mess of things and then when the party tries to get rid of the sort of people who caused it, they complain about that too.  There is no pleasing some people.

What do her constituents think? Is it right that a few Labour party members can try to remove an MP voted in by the constituency?

[sheffbag]

i would hardly call 27 people "the party" .  I would call the 22, 807 people who DEMOCRATICALLY  (if we are using caps) voted for her in the last election "the party", not the 0.12% of the voters who voted in a meeting. Wouldnt you?

Should Labour now throw out Chuka Umunna for supporting her? 

She has been a Corbyn opposer since day 1. Why wasn't she given a vote of no-confidence then? By your reasoning all members who dare speak out against Saint Jez or disagree with his policies should be removed. That's not democracy.

People don't vote in general elections for the leader of a party. They vote for the candidate put forward by the party. Maybe I'm being naive but when i voted at the elections i've voted at i didn't look at who the leader was and voted for them. I voted for the candidate who i felt would do the best for my borough regardless of party. 

Except once, and that was because i thought the person leading the party was an idiot who couldn't govern .  Round here it makes no difference in the main as Labour get in at the majority of the wards but whoever the leader will never influence my vote in a positive sense. I want an MP for my region. 

22,807 votes out of 49,787 votes cast - that's democracy

27 people out of an electorate of 71,293 - that's not democracy. 

Edited November 20, 2018 by sheffbag

[bendix]

On ‎11‎/‎18‎/‎2018 at 11:35 AM, Mister M said:

Funny how forum Tories are so dismissive of Diane Abbott, but have said nothing about Karen Bradley, the clueless Northern Ireland minister who said:

 

"I freely admit that when I started this job, I didn’t understand some of the deep-seated and deep-rooted issues that there are in Northern Ireland," she told the magazine.

“I didn’t understand things like when elections are fought for example in Northern Ireland, people who are nationalists don’t vote for unionist parties and vice-versa. "

 

Actually I think you'll find most conservatives are as disillusioned with the current state of mediocre talent in the Tory Government, as we are of the Labour Party.    It's only the greater ineptitude of the Labour Party that keeps this bunch ahead in the opinion polls.

Oh for a party full of Kenneth Clarks

 

 

 

[AlexAtkin]

Is undermining the party as a whole good for her constituency though?  You can be critical of him without undermining Labours chances of getting voted in thus undermining everything else she tries to do then.

I didn't vote only for Corbyn, heck I would have voted Labour anyway as its better than the alternatives, but I WAS encouraged by the prospect of him bringing the party back to the left where it was supposed to be thus becoming a member for the first time.

[truman]

12 minutes ago, AlexAtkin said:

Is undermining the party as a whole good for her constituency though?  You can be critical of him without undermining Labours chances of getting voted in thus undermining everything else she tries to do then.

I didn't vote only for Corbyn, heck I would have voted Labour anyway as its better than the alternatives, but I WAS encouraged by the prospect of him bringing the party back to the left where it was supposed to be thus becoming a member for the first time.

Not quite democratic though when a few can outweigh the many (See what I did there?  )

[AlexAtkin]

2 hours ago, truman said:

Not quite democratic though when a few can outweigh the many (See what I did there?  )

Fair point, I still step back and say that I'm not disagreeing that there needs to be a bigger mandate for her to automatically be kicked out by the vote, but on the other hand if her actions are undermining the Labour Party as a whole there still should be something done.