The Labour Party. All discussion here please

[Anna B]

Jeremy Corbyn tabled a motion of no confidence in Theresa May to force a vote on the Brexit deal, and to make her disclose details of the discussions held in Brussels.  He says the clock is ticking, and sitting on the vote indefinately is disasterous.

[L00b]

22 minutes ago, makapaka said:

There needs to be a General Election for him to take power.

 

Amazing that whilst the Conservative government continues with their wanton destruction of the UK people still find time to moan about the opposition leader.

 I’m amazed that you find it amazing that people criticise Corbyn’s steadfast complicity in that wanton destruction of the U.K. over the past couple of years.

 

Labour should be a comfortable 10-15% ahead of the Tories by now, in any poll you care to name. He’s no more of a leader than a statesman. 

Edited December 18, 2018 by L00b

[Anna B]

7 minutes ago, L00b said:

 I’m amazed that you find it amazing that people criticise Corbyn’s steadfast complicity in that wanton destruction of the U.K. over the past couple of years.

 

Labour should be a comfortable 10-15% ahead of the Tories by now, in any poll you care to name. He’s no more of a leader than a statesman. 

What complicity would that be?

 

He's fought tooth and nail against most Tory policies, but hasn't had the coverage (except on social media where his stands and speeches in Parliament have been posted.) In fact while the Tories have been faffing about with Brexit, he's been calling for them to remember they have a duty to the country in crisis that also needs serius attention.

[Mister M]

49 minutes ago, makapaka said:

There needs to be a General Election for him to take power.

 

Amazing that whilst the Conservative government continues with their wanton destruction of the UK people still find time to moan about the opposition leader.

I get the impression that if it were Corbyn in government and he was presiding over this mess, those who are moaning about him now, would be on here 24 hours a day, berating him. Because it's May and her Conservatives, they're given much more license.

[L00b]

36 minutes ago, Anna B said:

What complicity would that be?

His voting record, Labour HoC whipping orders, and party deselections since the referendum. The clearest, most obvious, actions-louder-than-words, on-record and publicly-available stuff to begin with.

 

Then we can look at the UKIP-worthy, jobs-stealing society-impoverishing EU immigrants narrative in his discourses within that same timeframe. Likewise well on-record, but that's just words, not actions like HoC votes are. 

 

He might well mean better for British society, than Farage and the Tories. The problems are, his votes don’t validate that hypothesis, and clearly he’s useless as the opposition figurehead, what with Labour still trailing the Tories in all polls after 2 years’ worth of an uninterruptedly-open goal across the pitch, what is more with the opposing team running around like headless chickens the whole time.

 

You can perfectly well like him for his ideas. But no, he’s neither a leader, nor a statesman. Just an average backbencher caught out by the Peter principle.

Edited December 18, 2018 by L00b

[alchresearch]

1 hour ago, makapaka said:

Amazing that whilst the Conservative government continues with their wanton destruction of the UK people still find time to moan about the opposition leader.

We want a STRONG opposition leader.  We don't have one.

 

A strong opposition leader can make the party in power toe the line, work harder as they feel they're about to be ousted.

 

Corbyn doesn't do any of that - especially when you have Labour supporters saying they'll never vote for Labour while Corbyn is in charge.

1 hour ago, Anna B said:

What complicity would that be?

 

He's fought tooth and nail against most Tory policies, but hasn't had the coverage (except on social media where his stands and speeches in Parliament have been posted.) In fact while the Tories have been faffing about with Brexit, he's been calling for them to remember they have a duty to the country in crisis that also needs serius attention.

OK, lets just take on board that the nasty media are all against him.

But he has a massive following on social media.

 

If Corbyn is so good then why isn't Labour miles ahead in the polls?

[sheffbag]

1 hour ago, Anna B said:

Jeremy Corbyn tabled a motion of no confidence in Theresa May to force a vote on the Brexit deal, and to make her disclose details of the discussions held in Brussels.  He says the clock is ticking, and sitting on the vote indefinately is disasterous.

and he's left it too late for the discussion to take place unless the govt allow it before recess. If he was a strong leader then why hasnt he called for a vote of NC in the govt? Even his buddy Nicola thinks he's wimped out on knowing full well that nothing will come from it and its a futile gesture of a weak puppet. 

1 hour ago, Anna B said:

What complicity would that be?

 

He's fought tooth and nail against most Tory policies, but hasn't had the coverage (except on social media where his stands and speeches in Parliament have been posted.) In fact while the Tories have been faffing about with Brexit, he's been calling for them to remember they have a duty to the country in crisis that also needs serius attention.

They have a duty to accept the will of the peoples decision to leave the EU (which will happen regardless unless a new law is passed) Labour are more interested in keeping the Tories in power but trying to change its leader and doing its best to disrupt the will of the people without giving an alternative. As the Labour MP said "the ones that moan the loudest should have an alternative" - Where's Labour's? 

[Top Cats Hat]

Labour should have bitten the bullet six months ago and came out against Brexit, taken the flak for opposing 'the will of the people', then stick to their guns and watch the Tory house of cards collapse from a distance.

 

Changing their mind this late in the process will just look like crass opportunism.

[bendix]

11 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said:

Labour should have bitten the bullet six months ago and came out against Brexit, taken the flak for opposing 'the will of the people', then stick to their guns and watch the Tory house of cards collapse from a distance.

 

Changing their mind this late in the process will just look like crass opportunism.

They will never come out against Brexit.  Why can't Labour Remainers understand that.

 

There are two core reasons Corbyn has been, as Loob suggests, complicit in the Brexit destruction of the UK over the last couple of years.

 

1) The first is that dirty Labour secret that noone in their hierarcy wants to talk about.  Rank and file Labour voters from Labour heartlands have been closer to UKIP on issues like immigration for decades.  Those are the people who tipped Brexit over the line. Corbyn gets that and he knows he will lose the working class vote forever by defying that opinion.  He cannot be seen as the man who finally snapped the link between Labour and the working class.

 

2) He is, and always has been, anti EU.   His political mentor was Tony Benn.  Him and his ilk have always viewed the EU as some kind of global capitalist construct, and fought vigorously against it.  

 

Corbyn is a craven hypocrite.  I would forgive that if it wasn't for the fact that he is still stuck in some kind of 1970s political landscape, happily playing opposition games of no confidence, tweeting about Venezuelen political leaders deaths 45 years ago, all the while ignoring the new political realities.

 

He is an abject failure as an opposition leader.

[AntiBrexit]

What the country is crying out for is an strong left wing leader who's going to help people not drag them into the ground. Every since 2010 we have seen cut after cut to the point were the country no longer works everywere one looks I see pain and suffering we all have moments in life when we hit the bottom and need an helping hand to get up again. I have mixed feeling about Corbyn he could be good on social issues but is weak on subjects like Brexit but I do understand the problem here come out has remain risk the northern voteing base who for most part are  pro- Brexit it is a fine line. 

 All my voteing life I have supported Labour probably always will who knows Corbyn might surprise us yet .