Ukip. All discussion here please.

[Tommo68]

It would appear that the next general election is intended by the manipulators of these things to be between the Conservatives and Ukip.

 

If the general dissatisfaction of the electorate with the the conservaties was as some people would like us to think then they would have eceived far less votes than they did recently.

 

The Lib Dems and Labour both failed to make a significant impact neither party has revealed plans to replace their rather ineffectual leaders. Clearly they can only be not replacing these incompetents because they do not want to run the risk of having to form a government.

 

There are no other significant parties that the general public as whole are taking seriously.

 

It now remains for us to see how both the Conservatives and Ukip are going to try to persuade the electorate to choose one of them over the other.

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[JFKvsNixon]

As we seemingly head blindly towards Owells three state world Amerasia Eurasia and Oceania..

 

I suggest that you need to read Nineteen Eighty-Four again, in my copy the states are called Oceania, Eurasia and Eastasia.

 

---------- Post added 01-06-2014 at 14:49 ----------

 

There have been calls to prepare Europe militarily to intervene in the Ukraine and annexe that into the EU. Then presumably and ultimately Russia itself.

 

You seem to completely misunderstand the current situation in Ukraine. If there were serious proposals for some sort of military intervention, which apart from the expected bluster there have not been, it would be to counter the military intervention from Russia.

 

---------- Post added 01-06-2014 at 14:53 ----------

 

Already the US and China are making their financial bids for control of Africa, its natural resouces and its potential to become the major source of crops for the world market provide great incentives

 

This has been going on for quite a while. China's investment into Africa has been substantial and has put them in the pole position in Africa, they are defiantly in it for the long term in regards to Africa.

 

---------- Post added 01-06-2014 at 14:56 ----------

 

Perhaps it is time we made the EU revert back to what it was set up to be.. a Common Market for trade not a single political all controlling entitity that governs the whole of Europe. More and more corporations are comming under the control of increasingly fewer cartels; likewise the media. The freedoms currently enjoyed on internet are slowly becoming under threat. The moves towards a cashless society, almost everyone instantly locatable via their mobile phones. I can envisage with some foreboding big brother comming through our tv sets (or PCs) within our lifetimes.

 

It's interesting that you say this, as the EU does seem to be one of the few institutions ready and able to deal with the encroachment into our lives of the media companies, just look and the EU backed victory against Google with the right to be forgotten case.

 

---------- Post added 01-06-2014 at 15:00 ----------

 

When we joined we in a sense dumped our main existing trading partners the Commonwealth. Did we see the writing on the wall and abandon the commonwealth before it abandoned us or did our abandoning it force its collapse?

 

I certainly believe that the writing was on the wall for the Commonwealth in regards to our trading. For years we got preferential terms from the rest of the countries because we were the Mother country. That was never to going to last as true independence was granted, we had to look elsewhere and like it or not we are Europeans so it does make sense to draw closer ties to our neighbours.

[Tommo68]

I suggest that you need to read Nineteen Eighty-Four again, in my copy the states are called Oceania, Eurasia and Eastasia.

Thank you for bringing that to my attention. I have made the correction.

My apologies it is some time since I read it and sometimes getting names of people and places wrong is related to my dyslexia.

 

You seem to completely misunderstand the current situation in Ukraine. If there were serious proposals for some sort of military intervention, which apart from the expected bluster there have not been, it would be to counter the military intervention from Russia.

Do I? I see it as a bid for control by both Russia and the Eu. It is the control they both want, concern for the people is just put forward as a justification for potential conflict. Conflict means profit, arms to be sold and loads of redevelopment after.

 

 

This has been going on for quite a while.

China's investment into Africa has been substantial and has put them in the pole position in Africa, they are defiantly in it for the long term in regards to Africa.

 

Very true and as people cease to trade in dollars for oil the US influence throughout the world will decline even further as their economy collapses.

 

It's interesting that you say this, as the EU does seem to be one of the few institutions ready and able to deal with the encroachment into our lives of the media companies, just look and the EU backed victory against Google with the right to be forgotten case

 

All this has done is make it harder for people with limited internet search skills to find the same information that will remain available to anyone that has or can employ those that have the required skills. A meaningless accomplishment.

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I certainly believe that the writing was on the wall for the Commonwealth in regards to our trading. For years we got preferential terms from the rest of the countries because we were the Mother country. That was never to going to last as true independence was granted, we had to look elsewhere and like it or not we are Europeans so it does make sense to draw closer ties to our neighbours.

 

There is a good argument for a Common Market and our being in it as there would be for maintaining our trading arrangements with the countries that were or are in the commonwealth.

 

I do not see an argument that can convince me that the Common market for trading purposes should have become the political EU it has become.

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Edited June 1, 2014 by Tommo68

[JFKvsNixon]

Thank you for bringing that to my attention. I have made the correction.

My apologies it is some time since I read it and sometimes getting names of people and places wrong is related to my dyslexia.

 

As someone else who also has dyslexia I can appreciate the problems, I do find though that the internet has really made my life infinitely easier though. With auto spellcheckers, a dictionary at the click of a button to make sure I'm using the right meaning of word and also as a general reference tool.

 

---------- Post added 01-06-2014 at 15:51 ----------

 

Do I? I see it as a bid for control by both Russia and the Eu. It is the control they both want, concern for the people is just put forward as a justification for potential conflict. Conflict means profit, arms to be sold and loads of redevelopment after.

 

I see it as the native Ukrainians continuing to turn away from the Russian influence. Historically it is easy to understand why Ukraine cherishes their independence from Russia.

 

---------- Post added 01-06-2014 at 15:57 ----------

 

There is a good argument for a Common Market and our being in it as there would be for maintaining our trading arrangements with the countries that were or are in the commonwealth.

 

I do not see an argument that can convince me that the Common market for trading purposes should have become the political EU it has become.

 

Is it posible to have a common market without closer political ties? For example to have a fair competitive market you would need the same employment laws, if you didn't a country who was over relaxed on health and safety, for example, would have an overly unfair advantage in that market at the expense of their workforce.

 

Another example would be the quality of the output, is it possible to have a standardisation of goods without closer political ties?

Edited June 1, 2014 by JFKvsNixon

[dosxuk]

The Lib Dems and Labour both failed to make a significant impact neither party has revealed plans to replace their rather ineffectual leaders. Clearly they can only be not replacing these incompetents because they do not want to run the risk of having to form a government.

 

I suggest you go back and review the local election results. Despite all the bleating about how bad everyone did apart from UKIP, UKIP still came fourth in terms of total seats won. Even the Lib Dem's, who are in meltdown, won more seats than UKIP. Labour had one of their most successful night ever in terms of seats taken off other parties.

 

Not that you'd be able to tell that from the media headlines.

[Snapshot]

Looks like the majority of UKIP voters will be doing the same at the general election.

 

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/ukip-voters-to-back-party-again-in-general-election-polling-shows-9465902.html

[altus]

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/jun/01/nigel-farage-ukip-schools-taxes

 

He said the party was no longer committed to a flat tax

 

I wonder if all those people on here saying UKIP's plan for a flat tax was a good idea will now start criticising UKIP for switching to progressive taxation.

[Tommo68]

As someone else who also has dyslexia I can appreciate the problems, I do find though that the internet has really made my life infinitely easier though. With auto spellcheckers, a dictionary at the click of a button to make sure I'm using the right meaning of word and also as a general reference tool

 

I usually check my facts .. misquoting fictional names is not going to be earth changing though is it.

 

Though it is a pity there is no spellchecker on here.

 

---------- Post added 01-06-2014 at 15:51 ----------

 

I see it as the native Ukrainians continuing to turn away from the Russian influence. Historically it is easy to understand why Ukraine cherishes their independence from Russia

 

I'm not disagreeing but sooner or later the Ukraine will side with one of the big states beit either russia or the EU. Then that state grows a little more.

 

Is it posible to have a common market without closer political ties? For example to have a fair competitive market you would need the same employment laws, if you didn't a country who was over relaxed on health and safety, for example, would have an overly unfair advantage in that market at the expense of their workforce.

 

No one makes anyone buy cheap goods or goods that are produced unethically.

 

Another example would be the quality of the output, is it possible to have a standardisation of goods without closer political ties?

 

Why should goods be standardised?

Poor quality or inferior goods will just sit on the shelf. I think most people are intelligent enough to know what quality they are looking for within the price range they can afford.

It's an old maxim; buy cheap and you buy twice ..generally.

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---------- Post added 01-06-2014 at 23:26 ----------

 

I suggest you go back and review the local election results. Despite all the bleating about how bad everyone did apart from UKIP, UKIP still came fourth in terms of total seats won. Even the Lib Dem's, who are in meltdown, won more seats than UKIP. Labour had one of their most successful night ever in terms of seats taken off other parties.

 

Not that you'd be able to tell that from the media headlines.

 

For a party in power the conservatives did not lose that many seats and the Ukip gains were proportionately quite substantial. labour as the main opposition party did not do too well and lost seats to Ukip. Lib Dems worst euro electionesults for 25 years.

 

I don't support anyone of them but its looking as though the next general election may well be considered by many as being a 2 horse race ...and its currently looking that unless the the conservatives and labour both get their individual acts together our next government will probably be a coalition again and I dont think the lib-dems will be a part of it.

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[skinz]

I don't have an opinion on it because I don't know enough about the area or the people living there, I just know that ethnic cleansing doesn't necessarily involve violence or killing people.

 

Examples?.

 

Still waiting.....

 

Still waiting, surely google is faster than this..

[Xt500]

I suggest you go back and review the local election results. Despite all the bleating about how bad everyone did apart from UKIP, UKIP still came fourth in terms of total seats won. Even the Lib Dem's, who are in meltdown, won more seats than UKIP. Labour had one of their most successful night ever in terms of seats taken off other parties.

 

Not that you'd be able to tell that from the media headlines.

 

Careful manipulation there ..........