Castlegate/old Market area redevelopment

[Guest makapaka]

I've had a quick look at the documents and can't say I'm very impressed. A thin strip of green at enormous cost. How does it improve first impressions of Sheffield when most traffic will come in via Park square roundabout, and scheme doesn't really extend that far.

 

---------- Post added 29-08-2018 at 23:30 ----------

 

 

Just off the top of my head: ... Failure of Sheffield City Airport (sold for £1.) Closing the City Markets for 12 years before getting round to building a new one, which is an awful design and in the wrong place. Deciding to move buses from custom built Pond Street, to 'sub hubs' all over the place. Taking so long to get the new shopping centre out of the ground, that shopping habits have actually changed before they've even finished it. Knocking down the eggboxes and the fire station (not that I was keen on either, but they hadn't been up that long.) Same with manpower services building at bottom of the Moor, and the hole in the road, all built at huge expense and demolished within 40 years. Redeveloping the Canal area, then cutting it off with a very busy dual carriageway and no bridge or underpass. Knocking down 2 bedroom counci houses with gardens, and building a glut of pokey flats..... etc.

 

Just to add to planners earlier points - the moor market opened in 2013 - the same year the castle market closed - they weren’t closed for 12 years at all.

[Planner1]

What? They have got the new shopping centre out of the ground? Can you give me directions to it please!

 

The new HSBC offices which are currently being built on the old Grosvenor Hotel site have retail units at ground floor level, so the building is regarded as part of the new retail quarter.

[lil-minx92]

The new HSBC offices which are currently being built on the old Grosvenor Hotel site have retail units at ground floor level, so the building is regarded as part of the new retail quarter.

 

Exactly

 

20 years in the making.

 

Meanwhile in Leeds..

 

2 large city centre shopping developments and now the council has approved plans to double the size of the city centre- making it HS2 ready for when the first train arrives. SCC will still be refusing to accept where the station is going whilst Leeds steams further ahead!

 

http://www.property-matters-law.co.uk/2017/05/leeds-south-bank-doubling-the-size-of-leeds-city-centre.html

Edited August 30, 2018 by lil-minx92

[Guest makapaka]

Exactly

 

20 years in the making.

 

Meanwhile in Leeds..

 

2 large city centre shopping developments and now the council has approved plans to double the size of the city centre- making it HS2 ready for when the first train arrives. SCC will still be refusing to accept where the station is going whilst Leeds steams further ahead!

 

http://www.property-matters-law.co.uk/2017/05/leeds-south-bank-doubling-the-size-of-leeds-city-centre.html

 

What has Leeds got to do with sheffield city council?

[lil-minx92]

What has Leeds got to do with sheffield city council?

 

Im just using the comparison to back up another posters claims that our council are a bit lame with a history of incompetence, and using Leeds council as an example of a successful operation that gets results.

[Guest makapaka]

Im just using the comparison to back up another posters claims that our council are a bit lame with a history of incompetence, and using Leeds council as an example of a successful operation that gets results.

 

But most of the points raised by the other poster were either nothing to do with the council or incorrect.

 

Here’s a story criticising Leeds council - does this mean I have evidenced that Leeds is an unsuccessful operation?

 

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/news/leeds-news/holbeck-managed-approach-leeds-sex-14813226

 

I don’t understand why you think a development on the south bank in Leeds demonstrates SCC incompetence at all to be honest.

[lil-minx92]

But most of the points raised by the other poster were either nothing to do with the council or incorrect.

 

Here’s a story criticising Leeds council - does this mean I have evidenced that Leeds is an unsuccessful operation?

 

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/news/leeds-news/holbeck-managed-approach-leeds-sex-14813226

 

I don’t understand why you think a development on the south bank in Leeds demonstrates SCC incompetence at all to be honest.

 

Quite frankly I dont thinks any comparisons are needed to demonstrate SCC's incompetence with regards delivering redevelopment of the city centre retail offer. An office block with a few retail units underneath is what they have achieved in 20 years.

[Guest makapaka]

Quite frankly I dont thinks any comparisons are needed to demonstrate SCC's incompetence with regards delivering redevelopment of the city centre retail offer. An office block with a few retail units underneath is what they have achieved in 20 years.

 

Well not really - Hammerson pulling out of sevenstone was the main issue there though wasn’t it.

 

Due to the great recession.

 

I’m not suggesting they are perfect but let’s not make things up to try and demonstrate incompetence.

[Michael_N]

You're blaming the Council for many things that aren't within their remit.

 

Bus operators don't appear to want to use the Pond St bus station, (probably because it costs them money), so they prefer a more dispersed pattern of stops around the city. The Council cannot dictate to bus operators and in any case, it's SYPTE who are responsible for passenger transport issues, not the Council.

 

The Fire Station wasn't originally owned or controlled by the Council and the owners can do what they want with it. As I understand it, the Fire Service wanted to move to a new location which was better for their response times and the Council wanted the site for redevelopment, so the move suited all parties.

 

The Manpower Services building hasn't been demolished. it's still standing and is used by the Council.

 

The Eggbox had to go to make way for the St Pauls development and the new Peace Gardens, which most people think is a very good public space and an improvement on what was there before.

 

Bridges and underpasses are not popular with pedestrians, who prefer surface level, controlled pedestrian crossings. There are pedestrian crossing facilities across the dual carriageway to the Canal Basin and you can also get across to it via the overbridges around Park Square if you prefer.

 

Bus operators do want to use Pond Street Bus Station, as this is where the main driver crew bases are located and it's a good transport hub, plus provides a place to stack vehicles. However, Sheffield City Council in their wisdom have slowly killed that end of town so much so, that footfall is very sparse and passengers no longer want to travel to here. It's so far from everything now - especially with the council intent on moving everything towards The Moor. The same can be said for the Supertram. Who in their mind would move the markets from one of the main transport hubs, to the other end of the city centre a mile away from the nearest tram stop? Plus many buses from the north and eastern end of the city tend to terminate around Pond Street and Castle Markets.

[lil-minx92]

Well not really - Hammerson pulling out of sevenstone was the main issue there though wasn’t it.

Due to the great recession.

 

I’m not suggesting they are perfect but let’s not make things up to try and demonstrate incompetence.

 

Theres a whole thread on that assertion!.. with a poll suggesting not much confidence in the Council overall. Hammerson were appointed in 2001. The recession came about 7 years later. It was another 5 years after that before Hammerson pulled out.

https://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=550735