Workers on the breadline.

[firemanbob]

Increasingly accessible for many of the poorest.

But nothing close to the amount we would consider normal.

 

 

 

 

The kind where some live a life without ever having property rights, and work hard and have nothing to show for it. Whilst others inherit plenty and don't have to work hard to reap what is sown by others.

That would be the majority of humans on the planet.

 

 

 

No, that is not the case. A proportion will never work. Presumably you propose removing them from the gene-pool in some form of labour/death camp?

The you presume wrong.

 

There is plenty to meet people's basic needs.

 

I agree, the problem is that people complain when only their basic needs are met, look at the UK at the amount of people that consume substantially more than their basic need yet they still complain about not having enough.

 

 

I fail to see how that is so? Surely it would be inevitable if there were enough resources for everyone, as they wouldn't be depriving others directly by being greedy.

There aren't enough resources for everyone to live a reasonably comfortable life. Look at what happens when it snows and deliveries to shops are held up, people start to stockpile food because their survival is more important to them than the survival of their neighbours.

 

Unfortunately the sheer amount of greed and waste, means in a world with plenty, some still go without the basics.

 

And when people with nothing are given the opportunity to live in a country with plenty they too become greedy and consume far more than their basic needs. Greed appears to be human nature, it isn't going to change so the only way for greedy humans to survive if for there to be fewer humans.

[Anna B]

There are many factors but the most important is earth's long-term sustainable human carrying capacity at what would be considered an adequate to moderately comfortable standard of living is likley to be no greater than 2 to 3 billion. It may be considerably less if the everyone wants a lifestyle equal to that of the average American. So for the cost of living to fall the population must also fall, poverty is an inevitable consequence of over population.

 

And that's a practical solution is it?

 

You're not one of these 'We need a plague' to reduce the population, conspiracy types are you? Hoping Ebola might do the trick?

[firemanbob]

And that's a practical solution is it?

 

You're not one of these 'We need a plague' to reduce the population, conspiracy types are you? Hoping Ebola might do the trick?

 

I did tell you that the solution to the worlds problems is unpalatable for some people. Look at the currant Ebola outbreak, their desire to help people is spreading the disease around the globe and will likley increase the number of people that die.

[gimp27]

There are many factors but the most important is earth's long-term sustainable human carrying capacity at what would be considered an adequate to moderately comfortable standard of living is likley to be no greater than 2 to 3 billion. It may be considerably less if the everyone wants a lifestyle equal to that of the average American. So for the cost of living to fall the population must also fall, poverty is an inevitable consequence of over population.

 

That seems fair enough. Didnt the Chinese do something about overpopulation by way of governing childbirth?

[Anna B]

That seems fair enough. Didnt the Chinese do something about overpopulation by way of governing childbirth?

 

They did, and it's backfiring spectacularly, there are now not enough young people to pay taxes. And old people are suffering with no one to pay or care for them.

[gimp27]

They did, and it's backfiring spectacularly, there are now not enough young people to pay taxes. And old people are suffering with no one to pay or care for them.

 

That backfired then!

[tinfoilhat]

They did, and it's backfiring spectacularly, there are now not enough young people to pay taxes. And old people are suffering with no one to pay or care for them.

 

So increased global population (with ever decreasing resources) is a good thing?

[gimp27]

So increased global population (with ever decreasing resources) is a good thing?

 

its not a great situation. We need to repopulate, yet would have better lives if there were fewer of us. How can we resolve this?

[Anna B]

its not a great situation. We need to repopulate, yet would have better lives if there were fewer of us. How can we resolve this?

 

Reduce children to 2 per couple and the population stays stable. You can encourage this with things like taxation and child allowance only for the first 2 children.

In developing countries, increase health care so that most children survive and perversly parents will have less, (they only have big families because they are not sure any children will survive, and they need them to work the land and care for them,) and introduce welfare payments like pensions so that they don't have to rely on children taking care of them in old age. Make the pension conditional on the only having 2 children. The more developed the nation the less children - our populaton is now actually falling, as is America's.

 

---------- Post added 07-10-2014 at 23:50 ----------

 

The cost of living is going up because the number of people competing for the worlds resources is going up, when demand is high and supply is low prices tend to increase, and demand is increasing year after year whilst the worlds resources are diminishing.

 

The markets are being artificially manipulated as Chem says. The money men piled into property and caused an enormous bubble that caused the 2008 crash. Now that that golden goose is shot, the same money men are now putting the money into the commodities market and artificially inflating prices for everyone.

[*_ash_*]

Did anyone see the Panorama programme 'Workers on the breadline' last night?

 

It was very illuminating in the light of government claims that we are coming through the financial crisis and are healthily in growth.

Basically the problem of consistantly low pay pitted against the continual rising cost of living is not going to go away, will get worse, and no one has any adea of what can be done about it.

 

It will engulf more and more people as time goes by. More and more of us will be working our socks off, and still find ourselves sliding into poverty.

 

(The programme will be repeated on Thursday, BBC2, at 12.20am. and is also available on iplayer. It deserves to be watched.)

 

Meanwhile Raghuman Rajan, Chief Economist of the IMF, has issued a dire warning that the world is staring another economic crash in the face, which we will be even less able to absorb than the last one.

 

Interesting times.

 

And yet you're still blinded by nonsense.

 

Panorama is at best as bad as the crap that you see on Channel 4. Even that is a bit insulting to C4, perhaps C5 is a fairer analogy.

 

The first 2 families just showed modern society and how ungrateful people are in such a ever increasingly* greedy world.

 

 

*you often use this term, but I use it properly.