How long until Cannabis is legal in the UK?

[Bonzo77]

Alcohol and tobacco were in use long before the health concerns became an issue, so it would be hard to make them illegal.

 

So was Cannabis.

 

---------- Post added 25-11-2014 at 11:00 ----------

 

I see your point but think in this case the harm and misery caused outweighs it.

 

Outweighs what?

[psynuk]

I mentioned sport earlier, as a rebuttal to cannabis costs the nhs money. It's a fair and entirely valid argument If your going to complain about the damage and cost caused by one thing as a reason for banning it. Then the other things that cause damage and cost should also be getting the same scrutiny.

 

It's about having control of your life.

It's not the governments place to tell me what I can and can't do with my life.

All the 'reasons' given for cannabis being illegal are utter crap.

 

The only remotely legitimate grievance the government could really hold is to do with tax and conducting business within the uk. and thats a situation that is fabricated by the government in the first place. and would only apply to dealers anyhow.

 

to say that cannabis causes misery is also laughable.

[RootsBooster]

So was Cannabis.

 

---------- Post added 25-11-2014 at 11:00 ----------

 

 

Outweighs what?

 

Sport, apparently

[Cyclone]

I would assume cannabis is illegal because of concerns over health (valid or not, different people will give different answers depending which side of the fence they sit).

Not really. It's quite well established I think why it was made originally illegal in the sixties.

http://www.drugwarrant.com/articles/why-is-marijuana-illegal/

Alcohol and tobacco were in use long before the health concerns became an issue, so it would be hard to make them illegal. However they do now have age restrictions, licensing to trade etc. so while not illegal the trade is (in priciple at least) controlled.

 

The Americans tried it, for a decade (alcohol at least).

 

Controlling such things is entirely sensible. Prohibition clearly is not as it doesn't work and costs a fortune, whilst massively increasing harm.

 

---------- Post added 25-11-2014 at 14:44 ----------

 

I see your point but think in this case the harm and misery caused outweighs it.

 

The point is that your opinion (or mine, or anyones) is not grounds to stop someone else, doing to themselves, what they wish.

 

You can think what you like about tobacco, but that doesn't make it ethical or moral for you to impose your will on someone else.

[DaFoot]

I mentioned sport earlier, as a rebuttal to cannabis costs the nhs money. It's a fair and entirely valid argument If your going to complain about the damage and cost caused by one thing as a reason for banning it. Then the other things that cause damage and cost should also be getting the same scrutiny.

 

I'm not in a position to say either way with authority, but IF the health issues that have been linked (correctly or otherwiase I don't know - I've not spent years studying it) they are somewhat more significant than sports injuries that I assume is what you are getting at.

 

A sporting injury will (in most cases) not prevent someone getting work. If the mental health issues apparently linked to Cannabis are accurate, could would cost significantly more to society (society has to care for someone voluntarily making themselves unfit to work).

 

It's about having control of your life.

It's not the governments place to tell me what I can and can't do with my life.

Up to a point, until it impacts society (see above).

 

There are plenty of things that are illegal that I would otherwise enjoy, but society (via the government) has determined I can't. I'm sure you'd agree with some of those things being illegal.

 

All the 'reasons' given for cannabis being illegal are utter crap.

If you say so. Maybe the stated reasons for it being illegal are rubbish, maybe not, but how about joining in the discussion?

 

to say that cannabis causes misery is also laughable.

Arguably it does, certainly while illegal it provides income for those willing to take the risk to deal with no thought as to consequences.

 

Perhaps legalising would remove the incentive for the less considerate elements of society to be in business.

 

Then again alcohol and tobacco is legal and that still gets traded illegally so I don't see that as a valid argument to legalise (removing the criminal element required to deal it - they will still be about if legal as people want to avoid paying the tax).

 

It may reduce the negative aspects of the trade though I suppose as margins are reduced.

 

---------- Post added 25-11-2014 at 14:54 ----------

 

Not really. It's quite well established I think why it was made originally illegal in the sixties.

http://www.drugwarrant.com/articles/why-is-marijuana-illegal/

Interesting read. Even if it is talking American law.

 

As for prohibition, I'm sure there are other substances/activities etc that are illegal (prohibited) that haven't caused bigger problems because they are prohibited.

[Cyclone]

Which things can't you do that you might enjoy that don't affect someone else... That's the key, you shouldn't be allowed to adversely affect someone else, but you should basically be allowed to do to yourself whatever you wish. It's your life, your body.

 

In the case where there is a cost to society, tax on the activity/thing/item should be sufficient to cover the average predicted cost. Just like with tobacco.

 

The illegal trade in alcohol and tobacco is miniscule. Legalisation pretty much kills the illegal trade. Who'd buy from a street trader if they knew they could get a clean, safe, known strength from the pharmacist. Particularly if it's cheaper (which it probably would be, given how cheap it actually is to produce).

[DaFoot]

Which things can't you do that you might enjoy that don't affect someone else... That's the key, you shouldn't be allowed to adversely affect someone else, but you should basically be allowed to do to yourself whatever you wish. It's your life, your body.

 

I understand that principle and subscribe to it, but unfortunately there are idiots that spoil it for everyone meaning legislation has to be written for all.

 

In the case of Cannabis, if the mental health issues are a genuine issue, a heavy user could potentially make himself unable to work. The taxes won't cover that.

 

Admittedly the same applies to alcohol.

 

Just out of curiosity, any idea if there is an equivelant to the alcohol breath test that can be administered easily at the roadside?

 

I sure as heck wouldn't want people (legally) smoking pot at the wheel (I know, some will be already), but without a test can we enforce that?

 

---------- Post added 25-11-2014 at 15:20 ----------

 

Of curiosity, those of you arguing for legalisation of cannabis, where would you stand on drugs like cocaine or heroin?

[Cyclone]

From what I understand it exacerbates an underlying mental health condition, but I'm not sure that causality is established. Ie it could be that those who have an issue seek it out as a form of self medication, rather than it being the cause.

 

I read something about some kind of roadside drug test, but I don't know if it's actually available or widely used.

 

Re: idiots that spoil it, in what way? Can you provide some examples?

[DaFoot]

Re: idiots that spoil it, in what way? Can you provide some examples?

 

I used to quite enjoy shooting (air guns mostly) as a lad living on a farm, would still like to own/shoot handguns.

 

Not allowed any more, even though I wouldn't be impacting anyone else.

 

I'm a bit hesitant to post that as I suspect the thread may get derailed into another debate now, but fingers crossed.

[psynuk]

what exactly is the cannabis plant doing to cause misery?

It's not the plant, it's the choices people make that causes misery.

It's not right to argue that criminals, who have no respect for anyone, who deal in cannabis and are prepared to kill to protect their income aren't the cause of the misery and then somehow plant is.

Those sorts of people have existed for thousands of years in all sorts of economies and the reason for the misery is greed and money. By forcing prohibition you simply take morals and throw them in the gutter as the respected and legitimate businessmen of the world won't work in illegal enterprise.

 

The reasons for cannabis being illegal are crap,

the health risk is so tiny to be non-existent,

the moral stance is a hold over from a bygone era.

 

I used to really believe that chris rock was correct when he said that one of the reasons drugs will never be legal in america is because 'we can't have wealthy brown people'

turns out he was wrong, drugs are becoming 'legal' in america

I can't find out who's doing the supplying (except some weird way that the drugs only come into existence when they are registered in the shops supply)

 

which imo is the best reason for legalising. If I want to buy 'fairtrade' cannabis it should be an option I shouldn't have to inadvertently support some vietnamese human trafficking organisation, or a callous mexican cartel.

I want to be able to buy from john smith in lincolnshire who pays his taxes and has a red tractor on the packet. iyswim