El Cid Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 They never increased benefits to be above wages. Statistics disclosed by the Department for Work and Pensions found that since 2007, average private sector pay has risen by around 12 per cent, while many working age benefits have increased by around 20 per cent. That is what I meant to say http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9774333/Benefit-increases-far-outstrip-private-sector-pay-DWP-figures-show.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Ladd Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 or died out of fuel poverty, or because the NHS haven't been able to provide the care that would save them due to lack of funds....very true, PT. ---------- Post added 04-02-2015 at 11:41 ---------- :hihi::hihi::hihi::hihi: Oh stop it! I can't take anymore. The Tories are all for big business. Businesses do not want to pay a living wage. I was watching Boris chair a meeting of London Tories last year (who also happened to be business owners) and they were putting pressure on him to scrap the minimum wage! The Minimum Wage was, with the Working Time Directive, one of the best things Blair (closet Tory according to many) did whilst in power. Those who argue against it are daft. However, it has had the effect of keeping wages down in recent years. The Tories are for big business, big business makes money, creates jobs, and any big businessman will tell you that to sell his goods and services he needs people to have money in their pockets. That is why its good sense to either increase the Min wage or lower taxes further. If they lower taxes then the loony left will claim that its the Tories favoring their mates again. If they increase NMW they will actually help the economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stranza Posted February 4, 2015 Author Share Posted February 4, 2015 Statistics disclosed by the Department for Work and Pensions found that since 2007, average private sector pay has risen by around 12 per cent, while many working age benefits have increased by around 20 per cent. That is what I meant to say http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9774333/Benefit-increases-far-outstrip-private-sector-pay-DWP-figures-show.html I agree with you. Wages should always be more, I disagree with the way they spin it though. Cutting benefits won't make wages higher. Wages should increase at the same rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apelike Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 I've read somewhere this morning that the reforms haven't actually saved a penny, just moved the money around a bit. Mostly benefiting pensioners who vote. I'll try and find it and link. You are right as any so called savings do not get returned to the taxpayer and just get spent elsewhere, and not so much on pensioners either. It just gives the false impression that their policies are working and unfortunately people fall for the spin. The Help to Buy Scheme is a very big drain, £3.7billion +, and needs funding from somewhere. One thing is for sure, all these cuts do not benefit the general population but give them that "feel good" factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotusflower Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 Isnt there a benefits cap? They should cap it, they should never have increased it higher than wages. ---------- Post added 04-02-2015 at 11:22 ---------- And they should get rid of the daft system, whereby pensions and other working stuff are called benefits Where is your proof of that statement? ---------- Post added 04-02-2015 at 15:33 ---------- Well done IDS, the quiet man has been effective. After we win the election the next phase will see welfare further reduced. At the same time Osbornes attack on the tax fiddles carried out by "celebs"is bearing fruit. Gary Barlow Jimmy Carr, Rooney and the rest of them now having to pay what they owe. This government is the most radical and effective since Thatcher. ---------- Post added 04-02-2015 at 12:25 ---------- Yes it is. ---------- Post added 04-02-2015 at 12:28 ---------- Your last line I agree with, the Minimum Wage should be the Living Wage, this would have the effect of moving inflation up slightly and generating the economy even more. Don't be surprised if Osborne doesn't do this after the election, its makes economic sense. Re my bold. I will say to you what I would say to him...you are both exhibiting a level of understanding and smugness that fits well with a Tory. Are these the sort of events and result you are both so proud of? http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/controversial-benefit-sanctions-driving-more-young-people-to-homelessness-charity-warns-9868906.html http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28776102 http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/hidden-homeless-benefit-sanctions-blamed-as-rough-sleepers-increase-by-a-third-in-five-years-10021643.html The policies you are espousing are creating an ever increasing underclass. The more wealth earned by the policies you advocate...the more wealth flows into the pockets of unscrupulous, callous, money grabbing scumbags. The wealth created does not filter down to the have nots and I defy you to show me that it does! Look around you...wake up to the growth of food banks, fuel poverty, homelessness, vilification of the disadvantaged, growth of zero hours contracts...and I could go on. Is this what you are boasting about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bloom Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 The Minimum Wage was, with the Working Time Directive, one of the best things Blair (closet Tory according to many) did whilst in power. Those who argue against it are daft. However, it has had the effect of keeping wages down in recent years. The Tories are for big business, big business makes money, creates jobs, and any big businessman will tell you that to sell his goods and services he needs people to have money in their pockets. That is why its good sense to either increase the Min wage or lower taxes further. If they lower taxes then the loony left will claim that its the Tories favoring their mates again. If they increase NMW they will actually help the economy. Please tell me you don't believe that! Even Cameron knows that big business is sucking the lifeblood out of the country - that's why he's recently tried to 'encourage' them with a soundbyte - that they should pay better wages - but he's not actually going to DO anything though, is he. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charmer Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 His plans are definitely succeeding. The graveyards are bursting at the seams with people who have been killed by the austerity measures. If they havent been given a heart attack from the stress, they've done themselves in! Can you link me to any pathologists reports that label cause of death as austerity measures please? I would be absolutely 100% confident in saying that the gentleman in the OP would have had underlying mental health issues that were bigger contributors to his death than an £800 debt. A person of sound mind would not commit suicide over £800. Alas, you will ignore this sense I have posted and instead use the death of the poor man as a political football to suit your agenda. You may as well spit on his grave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stranza Posted February 5, 2015 Author Share Posted February 5, 2015 Can you link me to any pathologists reports that label cause of death as austerity measures please? I would be absolutely 100% confident in saying that the gentleman in the OP would have had underlying mental health issues that were bigger contributors to his death than an £800 debt. A person of sound mind would not commit suicide over £800. Alas, you will ignore this sense I have posted and instead use the death of the poor man as a political football to suit your agenda. You may as well spit on his grave. How can you say that? The poor bloke was hounded because someone else made a mistake and overpaid him. The reason he gave for his suicide was being hounded over the £800 that he had no way to pay. Do you think he was being dishonest with his reason? What purpose would that serve, he's dead so makes no odds to him now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charmer Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 How can you say that? The poor bloke was hounded because someone else made a mistake and overpaid him. The reason he gave for his suicide was being hounded over the £800 that he had no way to pay. Do you think he was being dishonest with his reason? What purpose would that serve, he's dead so makes no odds to him now. People in troubled states often don't think clearly. Do you genuinely think that this guy had no mental health problems whatsoever? That he was completely hunky-dory and then decided, completely out of character, to kill himself over £800? Mental health issues are often very complex, there would likely have been a myriad of things that all came together to make this man feel so desperate that he killed himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotusflower Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Can you link me to any pathologists reports that label cause of death as austerity measures please? I would be absolutely 100% confident in saying that the gentleman in the OP would have had underlying mental health issues that were bigger contributors to his death than an £800 debt. A person of sound mind would not commit suicide over £800. Alas, you will ignore this sense I have posted and instead use the death of the poor man as a political football to suit your agenda. You may as well spit on his grave. Re my bold. As if! What an absurd thing to say. What are your professional qualifications for being "100% confident" about someone's mental state? Frankly, I find your comments in the last paragraph to be beneath contempt! How would you explain/be an apologist for the following? http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2015/02/grieving-relative-confronts-dwp-minister-esther-mcvey-after-benefit-sanctions http://rt.com/uk/209731-suicide-woman-benefit-axed/ http://disabilitynewsservice.com/2015/01/new-questions-safety-dwps-benefit-sanction-rules/ http://www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/11043378.Man_starved_after_benefits_were_cut/ That is a small collection of cases caused by that which you would defend! How proud does that make you feel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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