Work ethics and todays youth

[ubermaus]

Because the public sector does not have to compete to earn a living and husband resources to the same extent as the private sector (particularly at the SME level), and cultivates such a culture of HR entitlement and practices as frequent teambuilding exercises, weekly staff meetings, team managers and comparable low to mid-level management bodies, personality testing when taking on new workers, etc.

 

We can't afford all that HR namby-pamby stuff, time- or money-wise. We're straight as an arrow about the job, the terms, the pay, the everything; we provide an office manual with all the ACAS-compliant policies and procedures you care to shake a stick at; we provide all the access (informal/practice manager/higher up) for any HR problems; we're fair/professional/train people continually/pay people on time/don't ask anything beyond the job description and we increase everyone's pay every year.

 

All we ask in return is people turn up to do their job, do it well and stick with us (please). That suits most of our employees, but manifestly not all. Refer tinfoilhat's post #119.

 

This is curious, all I can say it must be the pension.

 

From what I hear HR in public sector can be a headache. Lots of politics involved. I also hear the perks aren't as good as they used to be (due to cuts). And that sometimes you have to send about 10 emails and get things signed off by 3 senior managers just to get a pencil.

 

Virtually everyone I know or have ever met HATES their public sector job and moans a lot! Teachers, HE, public health...etc. and is kind of worn down and tired.

Or maybe public sector just attracts negative people

Edited March 3, 2015 by ubermaus
....

[tinfoilhat]

My wife works for the public sector.

 

She often starts at 8am and is rarely home before 6PM and quite often a few hours after that. She regularly has to go into work for a few hours extra at the weekends, and she'll regularly bring some work at home.

 

And because she's on a yearly rate as opposed to an hourly rate, she doesn't get paid overtime.

 

I looked at Loobs job and did get excited a little 'cause I thought, ah, maybe I could see more of her around the house, then I saw that the training offered could lead to a £30k/45k job in London. So it's a non starter.

 

Then she's doing something wrong

 

It must be a professional job she has - I just don't see rank and file doing that much over and above. On the flip side has she though about moving to the private sector (presuming of course it's the sort of job that has a private sector equivalent).

[ubermaus]

My wife works for the public sector.

 

She often starts at 8am and is rarely home before 6PM and quite often a few hours after that. She regularly has to go into work for a few hours extra at the weekends, and she'll regularly bring some work at home.

 

And because she's on a yearly rate as opposed to an hourly rate, she doesn't get paid overtime.

 

I looked at Loobs job and did get excited a little 'cause I thought, ah, maybe I could see more of her around the house, then I saw that the training offered could lead to a £30k/45k job in London. So it's a non starter.

 

Yep. I hear this. Long hours and bloated senior staff on high pay.

 

I know one department where the director or the dept is incompetent, knows nothing about their job and earns more than the prime minister, 200k. That almost never happens in the private sector.

[tinfoilhat]

This is curious, all I can say it must be the pension.

 

From what I hear HR in public sector can be a headache. Lots of politics involved. I also hear the perks aren't as good as they used to be (due to cuts). And that sometimes you have to send about 10 emails and get things signed off by 3 senior managers just to get a pencil.

 

Virtually everyone I know or have ever met HATES their public sector job and moans a lot! Teachers, HE, public health...etc. and is kind of worn down and tired.

Or maybe public sector just attracts negative people

 

I bet you could go back to dawn of the public sector and it would still be doom and gloom. But I think that's the case for most large organisations. I was talking to a bloke who worked at a large manufacturing plant and he said there was always a rumour about impending layoffs and cut backs that never really materialised.

[Anna B]

QFT. We have openings right now (again), for:

 

2 audio secretaries

1 practice manager (HR + accounts ("bookkeeping plus"), without debt collection duties)

 

All 3 'proper' full-time contracts, generous salary (based on twice yearly benchmarks across the country), Westfield (top level IIRC) and pension, flexitime and whatnot.

 

Straightforward Mon-Fri 09:00-17:00 (literally that, I can't remember the last time any support staff had to stay behind, a bit or otherwise).

 

Proper 'old fashioned' jobs for life, with vocational training into IP administration (the sort of training and qualification that can land you £30k-£45k jobs in London any day of the week without breaking a sweat).

 

Guess what? Not been able to fill'em reliably for the past 2 years or so

 

Plenty of seemingly good candidates on paper and at interviews. Get'em in the job and trained. They leave after a few months. Mostly for public sector jobs (surprise surprise - there's your "work ethic" at work ).

 

Public sector jobs might be seen as more reliable and with better, faster progression. I'm surprised you don't try older workers in the roles as they seem less likely to move on. And what about mentors for younger workers? Some of them do need their hands holding until they feel comfortable in the job.

But I'm afraid loyalty seems to be a thing of the past on both sides. When employers can get rid of staff on a whim it's hardly surprising workers go where they can also get the best deal.

[tinfoilhat]

Yep. I hear this. Long hours and bloated senior staff on high pay.

 

I know one department where the director or the dept is incompetent, knows nothing about their job and earns more than the prime minister, 200k. That almost never happens in the private sector.

 

Apart from the co-op bank.

[ubermaus]

Then she's doing something wrong

 

It must be a professional job she has - I just don't see rank and file doing that much over and above. On the flip side has she though about moving to the private sector (presuming of course it's the sort of job that has a private sector equivalent).

 

I think middle managers can work super long and hard hours. I know when you get higher up its much more flexible (its expensive to get rid of you).

[tinfoilhat]

Public sector jobs might be seen as more reliable and with better, faster progression. I'm surprised you don't try older workers in the roles as they seem less likely to move on. And what about mentors for younger workers? Some of them do need their hands holding until they feel comfortable in the job.

But I'm afraid loyalty seems to be a thing of the past on both sides. When employers can get rid of staff on a whim it's hardly surprising workers go where they can also get the best deal.

 

They can't get rid of permanent staff on contracted hours at a whim. Anything to the contrary is flat out horse ****, and if you know anyone that that has happened to tell them to go to an employment tribunal and they will win very easily.

[JFKvsNixon]

Then she's doing something wrong

 

Or maybe she's done a lot of things right!

 

It must be a professional job she has - I just don't see rank and file doing that much over and above. On the flip side has she though about moving to the private sector (presuming of course it's the sort of job that has a private sector equivalent).

 

What she's doing isn't over and above it's what's expected of her., but she stands or falls by her results. I can't complain about the money though, it allows me to work part time and spend a lot of time with my daughter.

[L00b]

I'm surprised you don't try older workers in the roles as they seem less likely to move on.

We have a healthy age pyramid, and are not ageists at all. Of course, we'd sooner train a 23 yr-old than a 63 yr-old, for obvious reasons. But that's not a deciding factor.

And what about mentors for younger workers? Some of them do need their hands holding until they feel comfortable in the job.

All new employees are trained (think 'dual controls') by experienced older hands for a full month, to get to grips with the basics.

 

It's the very (historical) model of the IP profession, both insofar as support is concerned and insofar as the professionals/fee earners are concerned: you learn on the job under constant supervision. Because mistakes can cost £-millions, the firm to shut and your colleagues their jobs.

But I'm afraid loyalty seems to be a thing of the past on both sides. When employers can get rid of staff on a whim it's hardly surprising workers go where they can also get the best deal.

Fair comment. I'm just moping because I'm without a secretary atm