Why is telling girls to be careful rape apologistic

[loraward]

The level of drink required to be unable to consent means that no-one in that state would be capable of getting into a car.

 

Nonsense, the girl that Ched Evans was found guilty of raping walking into the hotel, so she wouldn't have been incapable of crashing a car.

 

You are now trying to say that drunken rape isn't rape though, right? Or are you still banging on about the very unlikely scenario of consented, then later claimed it was rape, entirely irrelevant to the discussion though that is.

No I'm saying the drunken people should take responsibility for their own actions, and stop blaming others when they make a bad choice.

 

 

Are you claiming that drunk women can't be raped?

Ofcourse drunk people can be raped.

 

 

Or are you now claiming that all claims of rape whilst drunk are actually just remorse for a poor decision?

No

 

 

 

Either way you're now trying to justify rape by making out that it was the victims choice or fault.

You are incorrect.

 

Yes it does. Because it makes them responsible for following that advice and if they don't then they can be blamed for not doing so.

Why would you want to blame someone for not following advice?

 

 

 

What argument? You describe an unrelated scenario on a tangent to the issue, and claim that it's somehow an 'argument'. It's just pointless blathering from you.

 

Its only unrealistic in your head because it's inconvenient and giving it any consideration would cause a conflict between what you think and realty.

[Cyclone]

It's not unrealistic, it's UNRELATED to victim blaming advice campaigns.

[loraward]

It's not unrealistic, it's UNRELATED to victim blaming advice campaigns.

 

In your opinion which I don't share.

[RootsBooster]

I went out drinking for the first time in ages last weekend, my wife told (asked) me not to get too drunk or get into any trouble. If I did, would that mean she was victim blaming?

 

Hopefully we can all agree that Morrissey's comments were well over the line of what constitutes victim blaming. I didn't think it warranted its own thread so I stuck it here.

Morrissey commenting on the Weinstein/Spacey allegations;

 

"People know exactly what's going on," he reportedly said when asked about Weinstein inviting actresses to his hotel room, "and they play along".

"Afterwards, they feel embarrassed or disliked. And then they turn it around and say: 'I was attacked, I was surprised'.

"But if everything went well, and if it had given them a great career, they would not talk about it."

"I hate rape... But in many cases, one looks at the circumstances and thinks that the person who is considered a victim is merely disappointed."

 

"As far as I know, he was in a bedroom with a 14-year-old. Kevin Spacey was 26, boy 14. One wonders where the boy’s parents were,"

"One wonders if the boy did not know what would happen. I do not know about you, but in my youth I have never been in situations like this," he continued. "Never. I was always aware of what could happen. When you are in somebody’s bedroom, you have to be aware of where that can lead to. That’s why it does not sound very credible to me. It seems to me that Spacey has been attacked unnecessarily"

 

"Throughout the history of music and rock 'n' roll there have been musicians who slept with their groupies," he said, while clarifying that he was not one of them.

"If you go through history, almost everyone is guilty of sleeping with minors. Why not throw everyone in jail right away?

 

Personally I'm very surprised and rather disgusted by this

Edited November 21, 2017 by RootsBooster

[leviathan13]

I know which parts of the city not to walk through at night. I shouldn't have to be careful, but that's the world we live in.

 

Why do we lock our doors at night? Because there are bad people around, so we take precautions.

 

No one is saying that it's the FAULT of the rape victim, but in many cases it could have been avoided had they been more careful.

 

I've been out of my tree so much on one or two occasions that i can't remember getting home. Anything could have happened to me. I've learned my lesson and try to be more sensible when drinking so that i am less likely to come to any harm. Why? Because i know there are dodgy people who will take advantage. So, i try not to put myself in that position.

 

Advising someone to be careful, sensible and responsible is not victim-blaming.

[RootsBooster]

Maybe I should have given it its own thread after all

[leviathan13]

Maybe I should have given it its own thread after all

 

Hehehe.

 

Sorry, i just like to ramble when i feel passionate about something.

 

I read the piece about Morrissey in the 'i' paper on Saturday... although, that was more about should a musician's views and opinions affect how we think about their music.

 

The only point that i can clutch at agreeing with him on is why was a 14yo person (could be boy or girl) allowed to be on their own in a grown man's hotel room. Where were the parents? However, that's not taking it away from what Spacey supposedly did.

[sgtkate]

I went out drinking for the first time in ages last weekend, my wife told (asked) me not to get too drunk or get into any trouble. If I did, would that mean she was victim blaming?

 

Hopefully we can all agree that Morrissey's comments were well over the line of what constitutes victim blaming. I didn't think it warranted its own thread so I stuck it here.

Morrissey commenting on the Weinstein/Spacey allegations;

 

"People know exactly what's going on," he reportedly said when asked about Weinstein inviting actresses to his hotel room, "and they play along".

"Afterwards, they feel embarrassed or disliked. And then they turn it around and say: 'I was attacked, I was surprised'.

"But if everything went well, and if it had given them a great career, they would not talk about it."

"I hate rape... But in many cases, one looks at the circumstances and thinks that the person who is considered a victim is merely disappointed."

 

"As far as I know, he was in a bedroom with a 14-year-old. Kevin Spacey was 26, boy 14. One wonders where the boy’s parents were,"

"One wonders if the boy did not know what would happen. I do not know about you, but in my youth I have never been in situations like this," he continued. "Never. I was always aware of what could happen. When you are in somebody’s bedroom, you have to be aware of where that can lead to. That’s why it does not sound very credible to me. It seems to me that Spacey has been attacked unnecessarily"

 

"Throughout the history of music and rock 'n' roll there have been musicians who slept with their groupies," he said, while clarifying that he was not one of them.

"If you go through history, almost everyone is guilty of sleeping with minors. Why not throw everyone in jail right away?

 

Personally I'm very surprised and rather disgusted by this

 

The bit that got me was him saying that if they'd had a great career they'd not say anything, yet nearly all of the complainants have HAD and ARE a having a great career. Lena Headey is totally making these allegations up because she's fame hungry.

Edited November 21, 2017 by sgtkate

[tinfoilhat]

The bit that got me was him saying that if they'd had a great career they'd not say anything, yet nearly all of the complainants have HAD and ARE a having a great career. Lena Headey is totally making these allegations up because she's fame hungry.

 

Did Lena Headey warn others? Clearly nobody warned Lena Headey. Yet, production assistants were warned but sadly in the entertainment biz they ARE nobodies. (theres a bbc article knocking around somewhere).

[sgtkate]

Did Lena Headey warn others? Clearly nobody warned Lena Headey. Yet, production assistants were warned but sadly in the entertainment biz they ARE nobodies. (theres a bbc article knocking around somewhere).

 

Reading a few statements from her she made a formal complaint and was strongly told to drop it. The point is that the reason all the allegations are coming out now is because the women that were targeted are now famous enough to withstand the inevitable backlash.