Why is telling girls to be careful rape apologistic

[Guest makapaka]

And what other people are saying is that well meaning advice is a precursor to victim blaming.

 

The analogy is false, fatty food is not an actor or 3rd party, it doesn't make you gain weight, your consumption makes you gain weight.

 

Some advice must be okay, I concede, and some is not, exactly where that line sits is a subjective opinion. I guess some of the things to consider regarding that line are factors like;

are you giving advice to all women, or someone you know?

Would you accept such advice yourself?

Does the advice fundamentally restrict the freedom of the person if it's followed?

Is the advice welcome?

Is the advice likely to be something they didn't know?

 

For example, if someone tells me not to get drunk because of the risk of being assaulted. I'd politely tell them to do one. Not their business, up to me, acceptable risk, and still not my fault if I AM assaulted.

If someone advises me not to walk into a particular area of a strange city wearing my rolex and drunk and alone, then I'd probably thank them and make a mental note. Still not my fault if it happens, but the advice is clearly well meaning and allows me to manage my own safety with information I didn't previously have.

 

On that basis, telling women how to dress is clearly not appropriate. They already know the potential risks, they shouldn't HAVE to change themselves to avoid those risks, society should do something else to fix the problem.

 

Of course society shoud do something else to fix the problem - but what about in the meantime?

[Cyclone]

In the meantime, if you tell a girl how to dress to avoid rape, then you're implicitly blaming rape victims for being attractive.

[Guest makapaka]

In the meantime, if you tell a girl how to dress to avoid rape, then you're implicitly blaming rape victims for being attractive.

 

Ha - what rubbish.

[Andy1976]

In the meantime, if you tell a girl how to dress to avoid rape, then you're implicitly blaming rape victims for being attractive.

 

You know rapists don't only rape attractive women right? It's generally thought to be about power, hence the rapes of 90 year olds etc.

 

---------- Post added 22-11-2017 at 12:58 ----------

 

...they shouldn't HAVE to change themselves to avoid those risks, society should do something else to fix the problem.

 

I shouldn't have to worry if I've locked my door. I do though. That's why I check twice.

 

I shouldn't have to worry if I'm safe in my Wednesday shirt, walking in S2. I do though. That's why I don't wear it round here.

 

I shouldn't have to worry etc etc etc.

 

It's all well and good saying problems should be fixed in society. They won't be though - not for many generations, if at all. Crime has been an ever present since the dawn of man, and I'd suggest ever will exist.

 

Whilst crime exists, giving sensible advice, not blaming anyone, should be accepted in the spirit it was given.

 

My insurer told me that I should never leave my car running outside whilst it warmed up, and that if I did, and the car was stolen, they wouldn't be paying me. Is that victim blaming?

Edited November 22, 2017 by Andy1976

[leviathan13]

And what other people are saying is that well meaning advice is a precursor to victim blaming.

 

The analogy is false, fatty food is not an actor or 3rd party, it doesn't make you gain weight, your consumption makes you gain weight.

 

Some advice must be okay, I concede, and some is not, exactly where that line sits is a subjective opinion. I guess some of the things to consider regarding that line are factors like;

are you giving advice to all women, or someone you know?

Would you accept such advice yourself?

Does the advice fundamentally restrict the freedom of the person if it's followed?

Is the advice welcome?

Is the advice likely to be something they didn't know?

 

For example, if someone tells me not to get drunk because of the risk of being assaulted. I'd politely tell them to do one. Not their business, up to me, acceptable risk, and still not my fault if I AM assaulted.

If someone advises me not to walk into a particular area of a strange city wearing my rolex and drunk and alone, then I'd probably thank them and make a mental note. Still not my fault if it happens, but the advice is clearly well meaning and allows me to manage my own safety with information I didn't previously have.

 

On that basis, telling women how to dress is clearly not appropriate. They already know the potential risks, they shouldn't HAVE to change themselves to avoid those risks, society should do something else to fix the problem.

 

It's not about blame!

 

In all cases, the attacker/rapist/thief/irresponsible driver should bear the blame.

 

BUT! We know there are dodgy people on this planet who are happy to wrong us in some way. Advising someone to take precaution against that is NOT blaming the potential victim. What it is doing is trying to get the potential victim to not put themselves in a position where something might happen.

[RootsBooster]

For example, if someone tells me not to get drunk because of the risk of being assaulted. I'd politely tell them to do one. Not their business, up to me, acceptable risk, and still not my fault if I AM assaulted.

If you were assaulted though, would that person's advice be classed as victim blaming?

[rollwithit]

Is health and safety advice at work blaming the staff?

[the_bloke]

Is health and safety advice at work blaming the staff?

 

It's an interesting analogy. H&S in the workplace is two factor; it identifies risks and creates a policy to either remove the risk or to be safe around it.

 

By telling women to be careful when they are out is acknowledging the risk and advising them to be safe around it.

 

Until there is no risk, you can't ignore it. Identifying and mitigating the risk doesn't make you a rape apologist, defending the actions of rapists with a 'but she was asking for it' makes you a rape apologist.

[Andbreathe]

Ha - what rubbish.

 

 

Do you down-dress to avoid being raped?

 

---------- Post added 24-11-2017 at 01:08 ----------

 

 

Until there is no risk, you can't ignore it. Identifying and mitigating the risk doesn't make you a rape apologist, defending the actions of rapists with a 'but she was asking for it' makes you a rape apologist.

 

Do you down-dress to avoid being raped?

[the_bloke]

Do you down-dress to avoid being raped?

 

---------- Post added 24-11-2017 at 01:08 ----------

 

 

Do you down-dress to avoid being raped?

 

'Down-dress'? Explain. Plus, why does telling a woman to be careful imply they should change their clothes? It's not something I've even suggested.

 

Do you think a risk exists, and if it does that women should ignore it?