Why is telling girls to be careful rape apologistic

[JFKvsNixon]

Oh the blame is definitely put upon the person who committed the crime! absolutely... And in all honesty, that's not always the case!

I've been out myself (back in't day) where I've witnessed one group of lads start a fight but then the other group ended it because they pulled out knifes and knuckle dusters!!! it was this second group that got arrested and not the ones that started it... Ridiculous...

 

Anyway, kids need to be taught about self respect and respect for others. That goes without saying though!

 

There's the discrepancy!

 

When girls are raped the campaigns start telling girls when they are out - to stay in groups, watch what they drink, and generally be careful.

[esme]

And neither should you.

If people get drunk it's their fault - if they're attacked it isn't. But being advised that by getting rat arsed you place yourself in a situation where you are more likely to be a victim isn't apportioning blame.(male or female,sexual and non sexual).

It doesn't do anything about the people who, upon seeing someone who is apparently inebriated, will decide to sexually assault them instead of helping them or leaving them alone.

 

Those are the people we need to address.

[Cyclone]

Often you read about police and other groups telling girls when they are out to stay in groups watch what they drink and generally be careful because of rapists.

 

Its the same as people telling me to keep my door locked or not leave valuables lying around. Its not saying that I am defending burglars or thieves its saying these scumbags are out there so be careful.

 

Yet whenever we give advice like the above to girls the feminists saying that we are apologising for rapists and we should stop rapists not advise girls to take care.

 

It doesn't make sense. Yes men shouldnt rape but while we are dealing with the scumbags we need to make the innocent are protected.

 

Its when the advise crosses the line from "be careful" or "don't leave your drink unattended" to "don't wear provocative clothing" and "stop leading men on" that it becomes apologistic for the behaviour of the criminal IMO.

It's probably also not helpful if the advice is unsolicited.

 

---------- Post added 23-04-2015 at 15:24 ----------

 

ladies who frequent pubs and night clubs regularly, increase their risk of being victimised.

 

it does appear that the effects of an evening out do place the ladies at more risk and it doesn't hurt to remind them of such.

 

The implication being that they should stop doing that (going to pubs) and that if they don't, and they are assaulted, it's somehow their own fault.

The fact is that going to a pub is not an excuse for someone to attack you, so there is little value in pointing out to a victim that they had increased their own risk by choosing to go out.

 

---------- Post added 23-04-2015 at 15:27 ----------

 

Oh the blame is definitely put upon the person who committed the crime! absolutely... And in all honesty, that's not always the case!

 

I've been out myself (back in't day) where I've witnessed one group of lads start a fight but then the other group ended it because they pulled out knifes and knuckle dusters!!! it was this second group that got arrested and not the ones that started it... Ridiculous...

Arresting people who were intending to commit GBH or murder and carrying offensive weapons is ridiculous?

[esme]

How exactly does telling people to be careful put the onus of preventing an attack on them?

Because it doesn't tell people not to attack others.

[Cyclone]

And neither should you.

If people get drunk it's their fault - if they're attacked it isn't. But being advised that by getting rat arsed you place yourself in a situation where you are more likely to be a victim isn't apportioning blame.(male or female,sexual and non sexual).

 

It is though. It's implying that you've made a choice to increase your own risk and that is therefore your responsibility.

Of course the responsibility really rests with the person doing the attacking, no matter how easy a victim someone was.

 

---------- Post added 23-04-2015 at 15:29 ----------

 

It doesn't do anything about the people who, upon seeing someone who is apparently inebriated, will decide to sexually assault them instead of helping them or leaving them alone.

 

Those are the people we need to address.

 

On the other hand, giving 'advice' to that group of people won't achieve anything, we all know that.

[Chelle-82]

There's the discrepancy!

 

When girls are raped the campaigns start telling girls when they are out - to stay in groups, watch what they drink, and generally be careful.

 

Women shouldn't have to feel they need to be told how to be careful. It's common sense isn't it. however, young girls do need be taught the art of how to carry oneself whilst on a night out and as I said before, a young drunk girl with a short short skirt around their neck isn't a pretty look! but this shouldn't also mean that they are to be preyed upon and to be blamed for the actions of a rapist.

 

Rapists should never be excused. If a man (or a woman) cannot keep their hands to their selves or control their desires then they are to be held accountable, not the victim. no matter how short that short short skirt was!

 

---------- Post added 23-04-2015 at 15:38 ----------

 

Its when the advise crosses the line from "be careful" or "don't leave your drink unattended" to "don't wear provocative clothing" and "stop leading men on" that it becomes apologistic for the behaviour of the criminal IMO.

It's probably also not helpful if the advice is unsolicited.

 

---------- Post added 23-04-2015 at 15:24 ----------

 

 

The implication being that they should stop doing that (going to pubs) and that if they don't, and they are assaulted, it's somehow their own fault.

The fact is that going to a pub is not an excuse for someone to attack you, so there is little value in pointing out to a victim that they had increased their own risk by choosing to go out.

 

---------- Post added 23-04-2015 at 15:27 ----------

 

Arresting people who were intending to commit GBH or murder and carrying offensive weapons is ridiculous?

 

No....

 

You totally missed my point.

[esme]

On the other hand, giving 'advice' to that group of people won't achieve anything, we all know that.

This may be true, I believe we should still try.

[willman]

Its when the advise crosses the line from "be careful" or "don't leave your drink unattended" to "don't wear provocative clothing" and "stop leading men on" that it becomes apologistic for the behaviour of the criminal IMO.

It's probably also not helpful if the advice is unsolicited.

 

---------- Post added 23-04-2015 at 15:24 ----------

 

 

The implication being that they should stop doing that (going to pubs) and that if they don't, and they are assaulted, it's somehow their own fault.

The fact is that going to a pub is not an excuse for someone to attack you, so there is little value in pointing out to a victim that they had increased their own risk by choosing to go out.

 

---------- Post added 23-04-2015 at 15:27 ----------

 

Arresting people who were intending to commit GBH or murder and carrying offensive weapons is ridiculous?

That incorrect - the fact is simple that those that do it are at risk. It also means that those places are where the undesirables frequent,so its a warning.

Where has anyone blamed the victim on here?

[vwkittie]

If you had a child (or indeed any loved one, I know I say the same things to my other half and make sure he has a way of getting home safely and he's a big 6'2 37 year old guy!) who was going on a night out would you really tell them 'get as drunk as you please, don't bother keeping an eye on your drinks because it's not your fault if it gets spiked, and don't worry about arranging to get a proper taxi or lift home, just get in any old car with a random stranger'. No you would not and if you did you'd be being a massively irresponsible because we live in a world where bad stuff happens.

 

Not educating people to take care of themselves is NOT going to magically rid the world of rapists and muggers. That's like saying if we all stop bothering to lock our houses and just educate theives we'll get rid of burglaries. Yeah... right.

 

Anyway it's not even all about rape, if you're getting ridiculously drunk and walking home alone you're also at increased risk of having an accident, there've been cases where people have passed out and frozen to death or fallen in a canal and drowned. It's just common sense.

 

Obviously no one should EVER say anything like 'well you shouldn't have been in that alley, that's why you got raped', but that is entirely different to saying 'please take care and don't walk home alone'.

[willman]

I visited Morrisons today, a tannoy warning advised me to put my valuables safe.

It didn't tell all the thieves to leave the building.

Are they blaming me or warning me?

Are they notifying the criminals that they know they're operating and are trying to prevent the opportunities available to them.?

 

I had my laptop rebuilt or reinstalled rather last month after it crashed - the pc guy advised against visiting dodgy sites.

Was he blaming me for the damage it could do to my laptop? Or warning me that bad people do bad things to good people for no reason other than they can ?