Should Labour move right or left?

[tinfoilhat]

http://www.sheffieldtelegraph.co.uk/news/local/labour-leadership-front-runner-jeremy-corbyn-to-speak-in-doncaster-1-7390157

 

He did make me chuckle earlier. He's going to reindustrialise the north with super fast broadband and fully funded bus services. No more pushing bikes up them cobbled streets when corbyn wins!!

 

Oh and he's also going to reprioritse arts funding to the north. This could be the push we need to get billy Elliot 2 made.

[DrNorm]

Thats true, i think they have compromised too much. and look like a watered down version of the Tory party, just in the hope that they will become popular to the voters...

 

Well I don't buy that characterisation. But ... it is important to find policies that resonate with the electorate while being responsible. Attempting to be popular without responsibility won't swing it with the voters. You could argue that this is what the far left of the Labour party are attempting, and it doesn't work.

 

out of curiosity, have you read what Corbyn has proposed, and what are your views?

 

I'll admit it no I haven't. Neither have I read what all the others have proposed (have you?). I think we all inevitably form judgments on small snaphots and impressions. Voters won't go out of their way either to read what Corbyn has written. His mark as a leader depends on making an impression fast, making it stick and making the voters believe in him as a person. (This may not be the best way to choose a leader and a set of policies, but it's what we have)

 

On a side note, the offer to the Blairites to take a role in the new emerging party, is exactly what the man is about, when compared to the many Blairites who have openly stated they will not work with Corbyn and that it would split the party...thus trying to force the voter to pick Burnham or Cooper out of a fear of destroying the party, not what i would call democratic at all, the contenders should put their proposals to the voters and leave it at that,

 

I sympathise with what you're saying here. It's the responsibility of everyone in the party, leadership candidates and members, to think beyond 12th Sep and how everyone can support the leader, whoever it is, and ensure the party doesn't split. We all have a favourite, and if our favourite loses that's going to be tough.

 

At the moment the voters seem to like Jeremy Corbyn's straight talking no nonsense approach, i notice this evening that there were over 2.500 people in Camden to listen to him talk, the hall was packed to the rafters, as were the two side rooms, and there was still a huge crowd of people outside that could not get in

 

You mustn't confuse popularity within the party with popularity with the voters.

[Flanker7]

DrNorm - "You mustn't confuse popularity within the party with popularity with the voters".

 

This is an election within the Labour Party -

 

Are the voters in THIS election savvy enough to see beyond the result to what the elected leader is in place to do? They may even question if his main job is to win the next election.

OR / AND

Can they bring themselves to vote for someone they don't agree with?

 

Labourites may have a problem with all these points (and others). It is something that a Tory has much less problem with - they just want the power for the powers sake. To be the boss 'cos it is their right, wot they have been bred for.

Edited August 4, 2015 by Flanker7

[DrNorm]

This is an election within the Labour Party ...

 

Whereas differences will be highlighted within the leadership election, [we] mustn't forget the underlying common values.

[banjodeano]

Well I don't buy that characterisation. But ... it is important to find policies that resonate with the electorate while being responsible. Attempting to be popular without responsibility won't swing it with the voters. You could argue that this is what the far left of the Labour party are attempting, and it doesn't work.

 

 

 

I'll admit it no I haven't. Neither have I read what all the others have proposed (have you?). I think we all inevitably form judgments on small snaphots and impressions. Voters won't go out of their way either to read what Corbyn has written. His mark as a leader depends on making an impression fast, making it stick and making the voters believe in him as a person. (This may not be the best way to choose a leader and a set of policies, but it's what we have)

 

 

 

I sympathise with what you're saying here. It's the responsibility of everyone in the party, leadership candidates and members, to think beyond 12th Sep and how everyone can support the leader, whoever it is, and ensure the party doesn't split. We all have a favourite, and if our favourite loses that's going to be tough.

 

 

 

You mustn't confuse popularity within the party with popularity with the voters.

 

Well, excuse me for asking, but how can you form an opinion on someone not being suitable to lead a party, if you have not read what they are actually proposing (apologies if that sound sarcastic), but he has stated on many many occasions what his plans and views are..

Have you formed your opinion because he is from the left? or perhaps from the constant media slating of him? i saw an interview with him a few weeks ago, and it seemed that all the interviewer wanted to talk about was what his thoughts on Carl Marx was, he didnt seem to be that interested on his policies.

I would genuinely like to know how you reached your conclusion

As for myself, yeah i have read what the others are proposing, i look on their FB page daily and see what they are discussing, and to be perfectly frank....Nothing....they are just full of sound bites and saying what they think people want to here...

But this evening, i have noticed that Andy Burnham has actually put some meat on the bones, and actually come out with a policy that may be a winner for him. he has announced that he wants to nationalise the railways...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-33780754

Its a great shame that Jeremy Corbyn had actually announced this several weeks ago, Burnhams thinking is "if its getting him some votes, then it will get me some"........you see DrNorm, this is exactly what i am talking about, Burnham Cooper and Kendal have no morals or scruples, they will agree with anyone, or pinch or steal anyone's ideas to get in power, principles mean nothing to them, power at any cost

[DrNorm]

Well, excuse me for asking, but how can you form an opinion on someone not being suitable to lead a party, if you have not read what they are actually proposing (apologies if that sound sarcastic),

 

Yeah, shame on me (have I already said that in this thread?)

 

I respect the man, but can't help having doubts about his electability.

 

Just like I respected Michael Foot, his sincerity and integrity. And he was crucified in the media.

 

I don't want to support someone who's easy prey. Ed Milliband's bacon sarnie incident? Would it have happened if he'd been more robust in the first place? (I don't really know, it's just a question)

 

There's a part of me would love Corbyn to be the man to take on the giants, but I suspect he would be crushed.

 

Do I think many of his policies have validity and are based on the ideals of social justice and equal opportunities - even though I haven't read them? Yeah probably!

 

But I also think that Burnham (there you go, nailed my colours to the mast) would have a better chance of being elected and making more progress than someone who was more ambitious.

 

There's a quote in the back of my mind which I can't find .. but this is similar ... "The line between bravery and stupidity is so thin that you don't know you've crossed it until you're dead."

[Dyke]

They moved to the right way back in 1997 and will stay there unless Jeremy Corbyn becomes leader

[banjodeano]

Yeah, shame on me (have I already said that in this thread?)

 

I respect the man, but can't help having doubts about his electability.

 

Just like I respected Michael Foot, his sincerity and integrity. And he was crucified in the media.

 

I don't want to support someone who's easy prey. Ed Milliband's bacon sarnie incident? Would it have happened if he'd been more robust in the first place? (I don't really know, it's just a question)

 

There's a part of me would love Corbyn to be the man to take on the giants, but I suspect he would be crushed.

Do I think many of his policies have validity and are based on the ideals of social justice and equal opportunities - even though I haven't read them? Yeah probably!

 

But I also think that Burnham (there you go, nailed my colours to the mast) would have a better chance of being elected and making more progress than someone who was more ambitious.

 

There's a quote in the back of my mind which I can't find .. but this is similar ... "The line between bravery and stupidity is so thin that you don't know you've crossed it until you're dead."

I dont think he would, dont be fooled by the shabby clothes, and his dishevelled look, i have seen many interviews he has given, and he can more than adequately look after himself, he is clever, articulate and very observant, he has been in politics a long time and knows his way about..

So okay, i am going to bow out of this page, i have nothing else LEFT to offer. (see what i did there) its time for other to put there thoughts forward Its been great debating with you, wish you all the best

Banjo

[gamezone07]

Is Corbyn speaking in Sheffield?, he is doing Doncaster, last night in London over two thousand came to hear him, overspills rooms and a extra fire engine to speak from, with some teenagers who couldn't get in climbing up and peering through windows so they could hear him speak!

[Vague_Boy]

isnt that what i am talking about.?? taking it back into public ownership to stop the price rises to make profit for the rich..??

 

As someone who remembers the utter contempt and derision frequently (and deservedly) hurled at British Rail in the 70s and 80s, it's frankly hilarious to hear these reflections on a "golden age" of nationalized railways.

 

 

we are in a new era...the time of austerity is upon us....but not for the rich it seems

 

Austerity for the rich? Isn't that something of a logical absurdity?

 

If you're not dependent on government spending and benefits, why would austerity affect you?

 

I'm not rich but austerity, by and large, isn't a factor in my life.