EU Referendum - How will you vote?

[Eric Arthur]

I found one over 30 years ago,on EU funded courses for redundant steelworkers....it gave me something to move on to when I got thrown on the scrapheap.

I appreciate that you think you're being clever, but it's coming across as the opposite.

[unbeliever]

I suggest this for the stay in campaign:

 

Vote to stay in the EU, or they'll stop taking your money and using a third of it to bribe you.

[chalga]

I appreciate that you think you're being clever, but it's coming across as the opposite.

 

I can't be being clever as I have no idea about the point you are trying to make.

[sgtkate]

Thanks unbeliever.

 

Where can we find one of these EU money generators?

 

Perhaps the argument is that the EU has contributed to projects using our tax money that the British Government would not have done. And many of those projects have directly improved things outside of London. Sheffield has benefitted massively from EU investment, which would never have happened if the government (Labour or Tory) were in power. The Forgemasters loan is a perfect example, as is the moving Northern Powerhouse jobs to London of how the government under-fund and directly remove jobs from the North.

 

Without the EU I highly doubt we would have seen more than cursory regeneration of Sheffield City Centre. The train station rebuild was partly funded by the EU. Science parks have been created again with EU funding.

 

Apologies for a link to the Star without glum looking people, but it sums up the EU investment that have massively benefitted the local area. It's possible that the government would have spent this £1billion in South Yorks if they weren't having to pay EU membership fees, but do honestly think they would have done going on past and recent history? http://www.thestar.co.uk/news/how-1billion-of-eu-money-has-benefited-south-yorkshire-1-7383999

Edited February 24, 2016 by sgtkate

[chalga]

Steve Peers, a professor of EU law and human rights law at the University of Essex, has written a lengthy and authoritative assessment of whether the EU renegotiation here, at the EU Law Analysis blog.

 

To make life easy, here’s his one-paragraph summary.

 

It follows from the above that the renegotiation deal is binding – and anyone who says otherwise (without clarification) is just not telling the truth. But there are two significant caveats to that: (a) parts of the deal, concerning the details of the changes to free movement law and Treaty amendments, still have to be implemented separately; and (b) there are limits to the enforceability of the deal.

 

 

Gove is taking a bit of a pounding today about his claim that Camerons deal is not binding........here's an independent assessment.

 

 

 

And Lawyers For Britain:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

David Allen Green ‎@DavidAllenGreen

 

There are lawyerly points about what you mean by 'binding'. And I am neutral on #Brexit. But IMO Gove is essentially right, not Cameron

Edited February 24, 2016 by chalga

[unbeliever]

Perhaps the argument is that the EU has contributed to projects using our tax money that the British Government would not have done. And many of those projects have directly improved things outside of London. Sheffield has benefitted massively from EU investment, which would never have happened if the government (Labour or Tory) were in power. The Forgemasters loan is a perfect example, as is the moving Northern Powerhouse jobs to London.

 

Without the EU I highly doubt we would have seen more than cursory regeneration of Sheffield City Centre. The train station rebuild was partly funded by the EU. Science parks have been created again with EU funding.

 

Apologies for a link to the Star without glum looking people, but it sums up the EU investment that have massively benefitted the local area. It's possible that the government would have spent this £1billion in South Yorks if they weren't having to pay EU membership fees, but do honestly think they would have done going on past and recent history? http://www.thestar.co.uk/news/how-1billion-of-eu-money-has-benefited-south-yorkshire-1-7383999

 

Any evidence for this idea that the UK government would not have invested in Sheffield?

Any problem with using your vote, voice and pen to persuade your democratically elected government that they should?

 

---------- Post added 24-02-2016 at 11:15 ----------

 

Steve Peers, a professor of EU law and human rights law at the University of Essex, has written a lengthy and authoritative assessment of whether the EU renegotiation here, at the EU Law Analysis blog.

 

To make life easy, here’s his one-paragraph summary.

 

It follows from the above that the renegotiation deal is binding – and anyone who says otherwise (without clarification) is just not telling the truth. But there are two significant caveats to that: (a) parts of the deal, concerning the details of the changes to free movement law and Treaty amendments, still have to be implemented separately; and (b) there are limits to the enforceability of the deal.

 

 

Gove is taking a bit of a pounding today about his claim that Camerons deal is not binding........here's an independent assessment.

 

'Not binding' and 'limits to enforceability'. Big difference?

[L00b]

What do you think L00b, you should have got some impression of me by now?

As much as can ever transpire through your posts...Whence my invitation for you to 'pull the other one'

As I said, I'm generally in favour of steady as she goes <...>

I'd have a similar frame of mind...if it weren't for the weight which Germany has been throwing around, lately.

 

If the referendum was to have taken place a good 6 months to a year after she got chucked out at a German GE, I may have remained comfortably sat on the fence a while longer.

 

As it is, it won't.

 

A Brexit will make my life somewhat more difficult, but not untenable...and may well precipitate a sharp refocusing of the EU as a trading club, through the combined weight of competing renegotiation demands from other EU states emulating GB, rather than the federalised super-entity which it is trying to become.

As you might have detected, I'm thinking of buying a boat.

The sea can be the roughest of mistresses. 'bit like the global socio-economic context on which SS GB would sail, freed from the EU harbour lines...and the protection of its storm wall

[sgtkate]

Any evidence for this idea that the UK government would not have invested in Sheffield?

Any problem with using your vote, voice and pen to persuade your democratically elected government that they should?

 

Amazingly I did vote. More amazingly I only have 1 vote. And equally amazingly, not one constituency in South Yorkshire voted for the Tories either. So in fact the EU represents SY far better than the UK Government. Irony huh?

 

Any evidence that the UK government wouldn't have funded the North. Nice try, but as you have argued in many other threads, you can't prove a negative. However, if you look at amount of funding per capita for people in London compared to the North I think you'll have your own evidence as can best be demonstrated. http://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN04033/SN04033.pdf

 

While Yorks & Humber do slightly better than other regions, spending is considerably lower than London.

[unbeliever]

Amazingly I did vote. More amazingly I only have 1 vote. And equally amazingly, not one constituency in South Yorkshire voted for the Tories either. So in fact the EU represents SY far better than the UK Government. Irony huh?

 

Any evidence that the UK government wouldn't have funded the North. Nice try, but as you have argued in many other threads, you can't prove a negative. However, if you look at amount of funding per capita for people in London compared to the North I think you'll have your own evidence as can best be demonstrated. http://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN04033/SN04033.pdf

 

While Yorks & Humber do slightly better than other regions, spending is considerably lower than London.

 

We have, to my dismay, largely Labour MPs in Yorkshire. That's what the people voted for.

 

Things are more expensive in London. This affects government too.

Did you compare government spending to tax revenue by region?

[chalga]

Any evidence for this idea that the UK government would not have invested in Sheffield?

Any problem with using your vote, voice and pen to persuade your democratically elected government that they should?

 

---------- Post added 24-02-2016 at 11:15 ----------

 

 

'Not binding' and 'limits to enforceability'. Big difference?

 

See my edit.