lil-minx92 Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 I will probably vote the opposite of David Cameron, on the basis that he is Establishment and will be looking after the interests of nobody but the Establishment. I haven't noticed my standard of living improving over the years so it may be worth making a big change to see if things improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxy lady Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 Not all the time. Dublin Airport's new terminal has often shoved domestic flights through normal passport controls channels. But if you don't have a passport you cross the border and take the ferry to Stranraer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kdv1 Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 I'm well aware of this, Kdv1. I was just pointing out that claiming that Belgium has "exited Schengen" is a significant exaggeration: until the agreement itself is repealed, or a country unilaterally and effectively withdraws from the agreement with a relevant legislative instrument (decree, act, <etc.>), no country can be said to have "exited" it. Even if, to all intents and purposes, they effectively have Might be semantics, but it's important semantics. FYI, customs in Zeebrugge have been x-raying trucks and containers (for illegals) before loading onto UK-bound ferries -just like customs do in Coquelles before boarding UK-bound Chunnel trains- for many years. Been through both (Zeebrugge, Coquelles) myself often enough in past 23-odd years. So these ex-Jungle migrants were onto a loser before they even set off Jury's still out on this. Fearmongers (on both sides of the argument) argue that the above will happen. Practicals argue that it will not. I'm with the practicals Let's hope your right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quik Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 I don't think that anyone has suggested that we should. You did suggest we don't have the balls to do what is required to keep these people out because we are too 'liberal'. I think you are wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kdv1 Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 Ok, how does the existence of the EU make this situation any worse. Without the EU the refugees would still make the journey, the border countries will still lack the will and resources to stop them. Obviously the leadership of the EU has been severely lacking, but I also fail to see any leadership from the European country's own parliaments, so what difference would the UK being out of Europe make to the refugee crisis? Probably none whatsoever. Fact is that a lot of migrants only want to come to the UK and refuse asylum in any other country they pass through. My guess is that won't change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 We tried that, it was called the Empire. They got the hump and asked us to leave. Look at the population projections for African countries - it's not going to get better, it's going to get much worse. So i'm afraid my 'hyperbole' is going to be reallity. The question is how quickly we get a grip. Things like jailing landlords who accept illegals as tennants is a start. The current fines for employing illegals are far too low and need far more enforcement. And the 1951 treaty is no longer fit for purpose and needs binning. Making life impossible for illegals here is as if not more effective in repelling them as tough border controls. The refugee's entering Europe are invariably from war-torn countries. If those countries hadn't been thrown into chaos much smaller numbers would be trying to get in. Fix at source is possible. ---------- Post added 25-02-2016 at 21:06 ---------- Probably none whatsoever. Fact is that a lot of migrants only want to come to the UK and refuse asylum in any other country they pass through. My guess is that won't change. Not borne out by the evidence. The refugees seem to be favouring Germany, Sweden etc... ---------- Post added 25-02-2016 at 21:09 ---------- You did suggest we don't have the balls to do what is required to keep these people out because we are too 'liberal'. I think you are wrong. We can already control our border. We have the channel, and opt-outs from Schengen and EU asylum policies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quik Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 The refugee's entering Europe are invariably from war-torn countries. If those countries hadn't been thrown into chaos much smaller numbers would be trying to get in. Fix at source is possible. ---------- Post added 25-02-2016 at 21:06 ---------- Not borne out by the evidence. The refugees seem to be favouring Germany, Sweden etc... ---------- Post added 25-02-2016 at 21:09 ---------- We can already control our border. We have the channel, and opt-outs from Schengen and EU asylum policies. No some are from countries where muslims are at each others throats, many are from useless african countries and thats it. Neither group are welcome and it's not our job to help them. A muslim/african Danegeld is not a solution. Detain/deport and if needed shoot if they try to forcibly breech borders is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFKvsNixon Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 You did suggest we don't have the balls to do what is required to keep these people out because we are too 'liberal'. I think you are wrong. I've said it very clearly that I believe that the problem needs to sorted out at it source, and I'll say it again that it's unsustainable for everybody concerned for such a large number of people to move to Europe. I have never once suggested with the numbers involved that Europe should accept everyone who wants to come here. There you go it's in black and white. What I do believe is that I don't think that we can find an effective way of keeping the refugees out, as I've said before they're too determined and there's too many of them. In spite of what you believe, we do live in a liberal democracy, and I don't think that we either have the resources or the stomach to build a "Berlin Wall" style barrier with machine gun posts cutting the Europe off from the rest of the world. Even if circumstances changed and we did build a barrier, I'd suspect that it would cause more problems than it would solve, and the refugees would end up still finding a way to get into Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken_lym Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 I voted yes, then noticed that the majority voted no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quik Posted February 25, 2016 Share Posted February 25, 2016 I've said it very clearly that I believe that the problem needs to sorted out at it source, and I'll say it again that it's unsustainable for everybody concerned for such a large number of people to move to Europe. I have never once suggested with the numbers involved that Europe should accept everyone who wants to come here. There you go it's in black and white. What I do believe is that I don't think that we can find an effective way of keeping the refugees out, as I've said before they're too determined and there's too many of them. In spite of what you believe, we do live in a liberal democracy, and I don't think that we either have the resources or the stomach to build a "Berlin Wall" style barrier with machine gun posts cutting the Europe off from the rest of the world. Even if circumstances changed and we did build a barrier, I'd suspect that it would cause more problems than it would solve, and the refugees would end up still finding a way to get into Europe. The barriers are being built all over Europe. Do you not read the news? And if the invaders ignore them then yes the will is there to shoot them. Our continent is far more important than the 'rights' of the tsunami of useless third worlders trying to get in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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