unbeliever Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 hope so however, regardless of what happens then i think something similar to what's happened with the scottish referendum will happen and whoever loses keeps dropping hints about wanting another one especially if the vote is close.... I'm ver firmly for Brexit. However if the referendum goes for remain, I shall accept the result and not ask for a future referendum on Brexit. I will probably argue for a referendum on any further transfer of competencies to the EU. Anybody on the remain side willing to offer similar assurances if the vote goes against them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quik Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 I'm ver firmly for Brexit. However if the referendum goes for remain, I shall accept the result and not ask for a future referendum on Brexit. I will probably argue for a referendum on any further transfer of competencies to the EU. Anybody on the remain side willing to offer similar assurances if the vote goes against them? Spot on. We vote we decide end of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Arthur Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 (edited) Anybody on the remain side willing to offer similar assurances if the vote goes against them? Not me. I'd be happy for Cameron to continue to negotiate additional benefits for the UK and put it to another straight in / out vote in 12 months, then repeat the process if neccessary. The democratic trend would be contagious and I believe that we would very soon see an EU that suited us and the other European citizens who don't have a vested interest in EU bureaucracy. Edited February 29, 2016 by Eric Arthur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 Not me. I'd be happy for Cameron to continue to negotiate additional benefits for the UK and put it to another straight in / out vote in 12 months, then repeat the process if neccessary. The democratic trend would be contagious and I believe that we would very soon see an EU that suited us and the other European citizens who don't have a vested interest in EU bureaucracy. If that's the deal, then the question on the referendum should be changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Arthur Posted February 29, 2016 Share Posted February 29, 2016 If that's the deal, then the question on the referendum should be changed. You are probably right but in/out on these terms makes it ever so easy and Europe is used to a war of attrition so we could just turn the tables and grind them down for our own ends. I don't think that the rest of the EU are comfortable with an EU without the UK so let's see how accommodating they are. If an even better deal can be put on the table next year let's vote on it. We can always rejoin too if it suits us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Equato Posted March 1, 2016 Share Posted March 1, 2016 Made me laugh that George Osbourne got the other members of the G20 to state that Britain leaving the EU would cause Worldwide financial turmoil lasting years (Or some such made-up nonesense). Would this be the same grey, rain-splattered, cake eating island which is apparently so insignificant industrially and economically that it can't possibly survive and prosper outside the EU, surely the World economy would barely notice, it would be as if Malta had quit the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L00b Posted March 1, 2016 Share Posted March 1, 2016 (edited) Anybody on the remain side willing to offer similar assurances if the vote goes against them?What would such assurances be worth? Not even the bandwidth they'd consume to appear on here The referendum outcome will be a fait accompli, so regardless of the side of the argument anyone stands on by the time of the vote, every (British) ordinary Joe will just have to live with it thereafter, discontently or otherwise. Non-British residents in the UK, and British residing in the EU outside the UK, will in both cases just do as they're told according to the negotiated terms, again discontently or otherwise. Edited March 1, 2016 by L00b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted March 1, 2016 Share Posted March 1, 2016 What would such assurances be worth? Not even the bandwidth they'd consume to appear on here The referendum outcome will be a fait accompli, so regardless of the side of the argument anyone stands on by the time of the vote, every (British) ordinary Joe will just have to live with it thereafter, discontently or otherwise. To my mind, the purpose of a referendum is to settle something big which is important to the UK people. We have no clear consensus but we need a decision. Ideally it can be used to bring an end to internal disharmony by saying something like "We've heard you out. Your view has been seriously considered. But in the end the people have spoken and that's an end to it". My side lost the AV referendum. I accept this result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L00b Posted March 1, 2016 Share Posted March 1, 2016 (edited) To my mind, the purpose of a referendum is to settle something big which is important to the UK people. We have no clear consensus but we need a decision. Ideally it can be used to bring an end to internal disharmony by saying something like "We've heard you out. Your view has been seriously considered. But in the end the people have spoken and that's an end to it". My side lost the AV referendum. I accept this result. I don't disagree with any of that. My post was merely looking at the aftermath in practical terms, in which context 'assurances to respect the outcome' are effectively meaningless: the outcome will be the outcome, and all voters and non-voters will (be made to-) live with it regardless of however they may feel about it after the fact. If someone was hell-bent on Brexiting but the vote went for remain -or reciprocally, for that matter- then what are they going to do about it, practically? Have a big moan and then what? Neither outcome will bring an end to disharmony, either. A vote to remain will keep cement immigration as the numero uno topic of concern and interest to British voters. A vote to Brexit will create a Himalaya of uncertainties for businesses and individuals about (continuing) rights of residence and employment, employment and consumer rights arising from readily-repealable EU legislation, structural and private investment opportunities, projected income tax levels and much more. Edited March 1, 2016 by L00b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted March 1, 2016 Share Posted March 1, 2016 I don't disagree with any of that. My post was merely looking at the aftermath in practical terms, in which context 'assurances to respect the outcome' are effectively meaningless: the outcome will be the outcome, and all voters and non-voters will (be made to-) live with it regardless of however they may feel about it after the fact. If someone was hell-bent on Brexiting but the vote went for remain -or reciprocally, for that matter- then what are they going to do about it, practically? Have a big moan and then what? Neither outcome will bring an end to disharmony, either. A vote to remain will keep cement immigration as the numero uno topic of concern and interest to British voters. A vote to Brexit will create a Himalaya of uncertainties for businesses and individuals about (continuing) rights of residence and employment, employment and consumer rights arising from readily-repealable EU legislation, structural and private investment opportunities, projected income tax levels and much more. Accept the decision and move on? You make it sound like any nation which is not subject to supra-national government exists in a state of perpetual chaos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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