foxy lady Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 I see Corbyn has been busily deleting all his anti EU rants from his website now that he has been told to pretend he supports Britain in Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 I see Corbyn has been busily deleting all his anti EU rants from his website now that he has been told to pretend he supports Britain in Europe. Yes. Good to see also that the chocolate ration has gone up again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zamo Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 "I don't understand it, so I don't want it!" The farmer said when the man explained the advantages of a tractor over a horse. The excuse always cited by those who peddle something people don't want to buy... 'there's nothing wrong with the product, the customers just don't get it!' Imagine a tractor manufacturer that made it a condition of sale that the farmer must cede the power to decide who can live on the farm and to set the house rules that everyone will live by. It is simply an unnecessary encroachment into the personal lives of the customers and that is just what the EU are doing. The EU ego is out of control. Instead of treating member states as customers, it sees itself as master and the member states as it subjects to command. Back in that trade body box it needs to go! Then more people will be interested in the tractor! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 It doesn't work like that, the number of people in each economy as no impact on how we trade and we won't become part of the Schengen area because any government that included that in terms of trade would become unelectable for generations. Staying in doesn't offer many guarantees, but one certainty is no control. You have been sucked in by all the scaremongering. It does work like that unfortunately. The Indians and Chinese education systems are producing millions of graduates they don't have jobs for. Every year. It is rational that they would expect a trade deal to provide some kind of release valve for that pressure within their own economies. The Indians already have negotiated this with the EU. The UK on its own would not have the same negotiating power. I'm not sucked in by any scaremongering, because quite simply this is not scaremongering. It is the truth about what already happens but happens in a way where we have the protection of the EU negotiating as a bloc of 500+ people. We dont have negotiating strength on our own. Simple as that. ---------- Post added 05-03-2016 at 13:35 ---------- In the last five years 2.25million EU nationals have registered for a national insurance number but according to the ONS just one million EU citizens have arrived in the country in the same period... yes, I don't think we know how many people are in the country. The EU position may currently be that there must be free movement of people for a country to have access to the single market but there is no reason that cannot change. The fact is that this is not essential for the single market to function and if enough countries say they don't want to be part of an EU on those terms then the EU will have no choice but to change this condition. And the political tide across Europe is surging towards political parties that want an end to EU control over immigration... try and look beyond the here and now. Brexit doesn't offer any magically solution or guarantees... just as staying doesn't. What it does is allow us to be the masters of our own destiny and that will do for me. Follow this link and you'll see a poll that list the main concerns of the British people. You won't find 'ever greater union with the EU' anywhere on the list. Staying offers a known situation. You can't argue with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
max Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 The EU ego is out of control. Instead of treating member states as customers, it sees itself as master and the member states as it subjects to command. Back in that trade body box it needs to go! Then more people will be interested in the tractor! Just once, I'd like to people to add: "in my opinion" when stating "facts". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutty27 Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 It does work like that unfortunately. The Indians and Chinese education systems are producing millions of graduates they don't have jobs for. Every year. It is rational that they would expect a trade deal to provide some kind of release valve for that pressure within their own economies. The Indians already have negotiated this with the EU. The UK on its own would not have the same negotiating power. I'm not sucked in by any scaremongering, because quite simply this is not scaremongering. It is the truth about what already happens but happens in a way where we have the protection of the EU negotiating as a bloc of 500+ people. We dont have negotiating strength on our own. Simple as that. ---------- Post added 05-03-2016 at 13:35 ---------- Staying offers a known situation. You can't argue with that. We wouldn't enter into a trade deal that involved the free movement of people from the EU, China or India, you are scaremongering, it won't happen because any UK government that implemented it would be committing political suicide, all three would still want to sell their wares to the UK and they wouldn't insist that we open our borders to their population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 Greece should never have fitted the criteria for entry into the Euro, you can bend the statistics and rules to come up with the result you want if the political will is there (Seemingly). Indeed. Which means the EU should have learned its lesson and should not allow an economy that is severely diverged from the criteria to participate in the Euro. On that basis we shouldn't expect to join, nor would be expect the EU to accept our membership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutty27 Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 It does work like that unfortunately. The Indians and Chinese education systems are producing millions of graduates they don't have jobs for. Every year. It is rational that they would expect a trade deal to provide some kind of release valve for that pressure within their own economies. The Indians already have negotiated this with the EU. The UK on its own would not have the same negotiating power. I'm not sucked in by any scaremongering, because quite simply this is not scaremongering. It is the truth about what already happens but happens in a way where we have the protection of the EU negotiating as a bloc of 500+ people. We dont have negotiating strength on our own. Simple as that. ---------- Post added 05-03-2016 at 13:35 ---------- Staying offers a known situation. You can't argue with that. The problem being that the known situation is undesirable and guaranteed to get much worse. ---------- Post added 05-03-2016 at 13:44 ---------- Just once, I'd like to people to add: "in my opinion" when stating "facts". Don't you think it would get a tad annoying if everyone said in my opinion before everything they say, might be best if you just assume its their opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
max Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 The problem being that the known situation is undesirable and guaranteed to get much worse. ---------- Post added 05-03-2016 at 13:44 ---------- Don't you think it would get a tad annoying if everyone said in my opinion before everything they say, might be best if you just assume its their opinion. If people preface their opinions with "in my opinion" then they may, just may, remember it is their opinion and not, just because they keep repeating it, a fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 We wouldn't enter into a trade deal that involved the free movement of people from the EU, China or India, you are scaremongering, it won't happen because any UK government that implemented it would be committing political suicide, all three would still want to sell their wares to the UK and they wouldn't insist that we open our borders to their population. No I'm not scaremongering. Free movement of people is a requirement for Norway and Switzerland participating in the single market. If we expect to follow either of those models it would be the same for us. Regarding trade deals with non-EU partners clauses around movement of people are already included. Bury your head in the sand all you want but these clauses would be foisted on us and we'd be in a weaker position to resist them. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/8051349/India-trade-deal-with-EU-will-allow-thousands-of-immigrants-into-Britain.html How is this scaremongering? It's the brutal truth you you don't want to accept because it interferes with your fantasies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts