runningman1 Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 Are we incapable of helping our farmers ourselves ? why do we need some foreigners to decide how much money our farmers need and when ? No we aren't incapable, I was just explaining why your claims of 350 million were disengenuous. Do you really think it is worth chucking are lot in and trying again. Put it this way, say there were only 202 girls in the world (same as the number of countries) and you had the 5th best looking, would you chuck your keys in the bowl to try and improve your lot, or would you be happy with what you've got? Things are pretty good here, why risk it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 The next 'pop at it' should be a referendum on whether England wants Scotland? I've yet to meet anyone from Scotland who voted to leave the union? In my opinion the result was fixed by the UK government anyway. Scotland can't keep having referendums if the result they got last time didn't suit? I've a feeling that the UK will end up staying in the EU purely because the result will be fixed by the government to stay part of the EU. All rather pointless really. IMO it will take a 55:45 vote in favour of Brexit before the government will consider invoking the exit clauses. Any vote for Brexit and Cameron is gone, most likely to be replaced by Johnson who favours renegotiation and a second referendum. He will only be prevented from doing that by a decisive win. Farage is already sidelined and marginalised anyway with the Brexit agenda captured by Johnson, who doesn't really believe in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nagel Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 IMO it will take a 55:45 vote in favour of Brexit before the government will consider invoking the exit clauses. Any vote for Brexit and Cameron is gone, most likely to be replaced by Johnson who favours renegotiation and a second referendum. He will only be prevented from doing that by a decisive win. Farage is already sidelined and marginalised anyway with the Brexit agenda captured by Johnson, who doesn't really believe in it. You can make up imaginary numbers, but what does the Referendum Act say? As far as I understand it the referendum is decided by a simple majority, however narrow or wide, just like in our general elections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLASGOWOODS Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 So you brought up a completely irrelevant topic because people on this thread have said outers are thick? Yes!....... ---------- Post added 17-04-2016 at 00:24 ---------- The next 'pop at it' should be a referendum on whether England wants Scotland? I've yet to meet anyone from Scotland who voted to leave the union? In my opinion the result was fixed by the UK government anyway. Scotland can't keep having referendums if the result they got last time didn't suit? I've a feeling that the UK will end up staying in the EU purely because the result will be fixed by the government to stay part of the EU. All rather pointless really. 1/ Yes....England should vote whether they want the Scots, and I agree. I think it were fixed. 2/ Yes again. I think the Euro-vote will be fixed. ---------- Post added 17-04-2016 at 00:25 ---------- No we aren't incapable, I was just explaining why your claims of 350 million were disengenuous. Do you really think it is worth chucking are lot in and trying again. Put it this way, say there were only 202 girls in the world (same as the number of countries) and you had the 5th best looking, would you chuck your keys in the bowl to try and improve your lot, or would you be happy with what you've got? Things are pretty good here, why risk it? Jeez! And you pull me for typing crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 (edited) You can make up imaginary numbers, but what does the Referendum Act say? As far as I understand it the referendum is decided by a simple majority, however narrow or wide, just like in our general elections. And the result is not legally binding. The government is not legally compelled to do anything based on the result, and the point I'm making is that anything less than a decisive result means that the political will is not going to be there to invoke the exit procedure. Cameron can't just do it alone. The process will have to be voted through the commons and the Lords and IMO if the referendum result is not decisive there simply won't be a majority vote to do it. 90%+ of MPs belong to parties with EU membership as a core policy anyway. Edited April 16, 2016 by I1L2T3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nagel Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 It would certainly be interesting if the government didn't act on a majority vote. Maybe it would be like the Irish referendum which was repeated until the stupid electorate got it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 It would certainly be interesting if the government didn't act on a majority vote. Maybe it would be like the Irish referendum which was repeated until the stupid electorate got it right. Yes that is what would happen. Johnson has captured the agenda from and muted Farage. Johnson wants a renegotiation and second referendum if there is a leave vote. If there is a leave vote Johnson will take over from Cameron and he could be in the same position as Brown was in 2007 - considered to have no mandate. He could use that to reinforce the need for his favoured renegotiation & second referendum, that is if he could remain in power without having to call an election. If there was an election then obviously the parties would have to state their policies re: invoking the exit clauses and I reckon all of the main ones, in the light of the economic shock that would be happening, are going to go around again with a referendum. Always, always remember that a leave vote does not automatically trigger exit. It all has to be debated in parliament and voted on. Only with a really decisive result could a majority to start the process happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runningman1 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Yes!....... ---------- Post added 17-04-2016 at 00:24 ---------- 1/ Yes....England should vote whether they want the Scots, and I agree. I think it were fixed. 2/ Yes again. I think the Euro-vote will be fixed. ---------- Post added 17-04-2016 at 00:25 ---------- Jeez! And you pull me for typing crap. Whilst it is simplistic, I feel it accurately conveys in an easy to understand manner my feelings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFKvsNixon Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 It would certainly be interesting if the government didn't act on a majority vote. Maybe it would be like the Irish referendum which was repeated until the stupid electorate got it right. They didn't just repeat the Irish referendum. They took the Irish views into account, made amendments to the treaty that they were voting on and then repeated the referendum. Isn't this how democracy should work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 They didn't just repeat the Irish referendum. They took the Irish views into account, made amendments to the treaty that they were voting on and then repeated the referendum. Isn't this how democracy should work? Nope. If that's the plan, they should change the referendum question. The problem arises democratically if a referendum is repeated because of one result, but would not have been for the other result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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