EU Referendum - How will you vote?

[Shef1985]

A saving grace, I suppose (and for all I know, maybe that's Corbyn's gameplan), is that a win for Brexit which would precipitate such hardline Tories into No.10 and 11 would quasi-automatically restore the political relevance and role of Labour, without much effort.

 

Haha, I don't think Corbyn has the political sophistication to think like that. Deeply troubling if that is his plan though. It should cost him his job.

 

---------- Post added 06-06-2016 at 15:13 ----------

 

Like I said before, I am voting out, for reasons stated.

 

No further comment? Come on High Greener defend UKIP, we're mauling it here!!

Edited June 6, 2016 by Shef1985

[L00b]

Haha, I don't think Corbyn has the political sophistication to think like that. Deeply troubling if that is his plan though. It should cost him his job.

Oh, I think he does. And if not him, then his game strategist(s).

 

What he certainly lacks is political capital, so sitting on the proverbial fence and letting the Tory civil war and the referendum outcome do his work for him at least political expense makes perfect (elementary, even) sense: irrespective of which Tory side "wins" the referendum, he'll have clean hands and a beacon-bright political target to point at after June 23

 

To my non-insider mind, that's what best explains him keeping his head below the parapet. His first outings about the referendum (was it last week, IIRC?) are not doing anything to dispel the fence-sitting IMHO.

Edited June 6, 2016 by L00b

[tinfoilhat]

Good question!!! UKIP and the DUP are the only Outers. Tories are neutral but more favour remain (of the members that have declared, which is most).

 

UKIP have wanted Brexit from the get go, long before Blair did them a huge favour.

 

So the question should be why is it that only a single issue fringe party that got lucky wants Brexit? Because it's a daft idea!!!

 

---------- Post added 06-06-2016 at 14:51 ----------

 

 

Nope it's right and wrong. Brexit is wrong.

 

Yes I know about Corbyn. As I state, his principles are lacking!!

 

I must admit, considering the fuss he made about he not singing the national athem its odd he's binned his principles over something as large as this.

 

That said, given the tories are tearing themselves to bits he is probably better off keeping quiet.

[Shef1985]

I must admit, considering the fuss he made about he not singing the national athem its odd he's binned his principles over something as large as this.

 

That said, given the tories are tearing themselves to bits he is probably better off keeping quiet.

 

Mhmmm maybe. Could be his downfall. I think there are only seven confirmed Labour MP Brexiters declared. A Brexit will surely call into question his campaign. On a personal level he might be delighted with Brexit but he will surely be ousted?

Edited June 6, 2016 by Shef1985

[unbeliever]

Good question!!! UKIP and the DUP are the only Outers. Tories are neutral but more favour remain (of the members that have declared, which is most).

 

UKIP have wanted Brexit from the get go, long before Blair did them a huge favour.

 

So the question should be why is it that only a single issue fringe party that got lucky wants Brexit? Because it's a daft idea!!!

 

---------- Post added 06-06-2016 at 14:51 ----------

 

 

Nope it's right and wrong. Brexit is wrong.

 

Yes I know about Corbyn. As I state, his principles are lacking!!

 

 

It's not wrong though is it. Certainly not in a moral sense. You just think remain is pragmatically better.

[Shef1985]

It's not wrong though is it. Certainly not in a moral sense. You just think remain is pragmatically better.

 

I know, it was a little play on words...

[L00b]

It's not wrong though is it. Certainly not in a moral sense. You just think remain is pragmatically better.

I don't think you can dissociate the moral dimension from the pragmatic dimension so easily.

 

There's a moral argument to Remain, in that working poors with the least transferrable skills can expect to bear the brunt of the expected economical contraction that would follow a Brexit, in the exact same way they bore the brunt of the 2008 recession. For however long the UK takes to get back on its feet and then catch up on lost ground.

 

That's without bothering to debate and argue the more pragmatic ins and outs of the government's expected tax receipts and its necessary spending commitments to preserve social cohesion.

Edited June 6, 2016 by L00b

[High Greener]

Haha, I don't think Corbyn has the political sophistication to think like that. Deeply troubling if that is his plan though. It should cost him his job.

 

---------- Post added 06-06-2016 at 15:13 ----------

 

 

No further comment? Come on High Greener defend UKIP, we're mauling it here!!

 

Why? Topic not about UKIP, Plus UKIP could could turn water into wine and still be mauled here, this is not about ukip, as stated this is about Democracy and immigration control, for me, maybe many others.

[Shef1985]

Why? Topic not about UKIP, Plus UKIP could could turn water into wine and still be mauled here, this is not about ukip, as stated this is about Democracy and immigration control, for me, maybe many others.

 

Fair enough. Water into wine huh? Staunch Labourites into essentially Hardline Tories is a good analogue. But you aren't hardline Tory are you? Only the party you support.

[unbeliever]

I don't think you can dissociate the moral dimension from the pragmatic dimension so easily.

 

There's a moral argument to Remain, in that working poors with the least transferrable skills can expect to bear the brunt of the expected economical contraction that would follow a Brexit, in the exact same way they bore the brunt of the 2008 recession. For however long the UK takes to get back on its feet and then catch up on lost ground.

 

That's without bothering to debate and argue the more pragmatic ins and outs of the government's expected tax receipts and its necessary spending commitments to preserve social cohesion.

 

That's a matter of opinion based on predictions.