Solomon1 Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 The whole premise for calling the referendum was after all based on internal politics within the Tory party Could you explain this to me please dude? And also why you and Sibon Are suddenly sporting union jacks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna B Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 (edited) Or maybe you would try and redirect the efforts of the club committee to make it a better club. What you are describing is like a kid throwing a sulk when he loses a game and taking his bat and ball home. ---------- Post added 22-06-2016 at 00:00 ---------- No we dont. But vote leave and you are going to get your UK-based right wing populists (make no mistake that is all they have become). You will have your right wing nightmare maybe before June and July are through. There is no evidence there will be a disintegration in Europe if we stay. There is plenty of evidence it could be triggered if we leave. What you seem to be saying is let's walk away and leave them to it. I respect your decision but we have never left Europe to fall apart. We have never walked away even in the worst of times. A Major part of the argument is that the EU can't be reformed. Heaven knows people have tried. It is set up that way. As Gisele ....? said in the debate, there are 5 unelected presidents (that hardly anyone knows the name of,) that can't be voted out, along with 10,000+ bureaucrats, all on the gravy train. They're happy with it. Why would they want to change it? Turkeys don't vote for Christmas... And there is no evidence there will be an upsurge of right wing racists if we vote out. I have more faith in people than that. Most people are not against immigration, they recognise the contribution they make; they are against uncontrolled immigration. There's a vast difference. And sadly the only way we can regain that control is by voting out. That means we can decide how many, and who we allow in, and they will all be useful and willing contributors to our nation. As for leaving Europe to fall apart, we never have and we never will. But the EU is a failing entity. It's gross mismanagement has failed several countries who are now baying for blood because they joined the Euro. Do we want to be part of the scrap, or be a balanced outside mediator if called upon. There's a good argument for saying we can actually do more good in the EU by voting out. We are not the only ones thinking about it. We are being watched very closely by other countries. When the whole edifice starts to crumble, then the EU might start to realise it has to think again and reform itself. Edited June 21, 2016 by Anna B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phanerothyme Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Jimmy Goldsmith's referendum party wanted the following question asked twenty years ago. The tories should have run with it, although they would still have lost to Labour, but I have no doubt a majority of the British population would have chosen the (b) option below. (a) Do you want the United Kingdom to be part of a federal Europe or (b)do you want the United Kingdom to return to an association of sovereign nations that are part of a common trading market Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXTickerXX Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Sun's front page today.. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClgVEzMWEAE7t5T.jpg Run it the day before the referendum and apologise after I presume. They are not saying which side the queen supports of course but maybe implying it with a question. I wonder if it will sway any voters who like the Royals. As an aside my mother is 74 and has no idea what to vote. I told her to phone her other 3 kids up and go with the majority as it will affect them and her grandchildren a lot longer than her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quik Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/06/21/calais-chaos-bbc-reports-major-migrant-unrest-channel-port-power-problems/ BBC falsely reporting illegal migrant savagery that shut Calais as a 'power outage'. So much for impartiality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mafya Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/06/21/calais-chaos-bbc-reports-major-migrant-unrest-channel-port-power-problems/ BBC falsely reporting illegal migrant savagery that shut Calais as a 'power outage'. So much for impartiality. my bold= Are you voting in or out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomjames Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 A Major part of the argument is that the EU can't be reformed. Heaven knows people have tried. It is set up that way. As Gisele ....? said in the debate, there are 5 unelected presidents (that hardly anyone knows the name of,) that can't be voted out, along with 10,000+ bureaucrats, all on the gravy train. They're happy with it. Why would they want to change it? Turkeys don't vote for Christmas... And there is no evidence there will be an upsurge of right wing racists if we vote out. I have more faith in people than that. Most people are not against immigration, they recognise the contribution they make; they are against uncontrolled immigration. There's a vast difference. And sadly the only way we can regain that control is by voting out. That means we can decide how many, and who we allow in, and they will all be useful and willing contributors to our nation. As for leaving Europe to fall apart, we never have and we never will. But the EU is a failing entity. It's gross mismanagement has failed several countries who are now baying for blood because they joined the Euro. Do we want to be part of the scrap, or be a balanced outside mediator if called upon. There's a good argument for saying we can actually do more good in the EU by voting out. We are not the only ones thinking about it. We are being watched very closely by other countries. When the whole edifice starts to crumentuble, then the EU might start to realise it has to think again and reform itself. You sound exactly like farage. A vote out is a vote for Isis, Putin, and every far right group across Europe like national front and national league that have openly supported leave. Not to mention conservative hard right, Britain first , the BNP. To see how we should vote look at our enemies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamston Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 You sound exactly like farage. A vote out is a vote for Isis, Putin, and every far right group across Europe like national front and national league that have openly supported leave. Not to mention conservative hard right, Britain first , the BNP. To see how we should vote look at our enemies. Nonsense. A vote a out, is a vote for leaving the EU and nothing more. Following your logic, then a vote to stay in, is a vote for the IRA and support for Gerry Adams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewalk Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Nonsense. A vote a out, is a vote for leaving the EU and nothing more. Following your logic, then a vote to stay in, is a vote for the IRA and support for Gerry Adams. What a bizarre comment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 You sound exactly like farage. A vote out is a vote for Isis, Putin, and every far right group across Europe like national front and national league that have openly supported leave. Not to mention conservative hard right, Britain first , the BNP. To see how we should vote look at our enemies. That's just about the worst system for making political judgements that anybody ever dreamed up. Dark Zen or something. Find somebody unpleasant and do the opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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