Fascists to Invade Sheffield. £500K Bill For Policing

[unbeliever]

the old freedom of speech chestnut, always appears when the EDL appear, funnily enough that doesnt quite get accepted with the UAF or Muslims tho does it? Oo

 

It most certainly does.

Short of advocating crime, the UAF and even radical Muslims are most certainly entitled to free speech.

Who say's they're not?

[melthebell]

It most certainly does.

Short of advocating crime, the UAF and even radical Muslims are most certainly entitled to free speech.

Who say's they're not?

same people who say the EDL are?

 

remember the poppy burners?

[Jonny5]

the old freedom of speech chestnut, always appears when the EDL appear, funnily enough that doesnt quite get accepted with the UAF or Muslims tho does it? Oo

Oh the irony.

 

Read Unbelievers post and try again. You either have free speech or you don't. We don't get to pick and choose and we certainly don't let some of the facist left choose what is or isn't acceptable.

 

When the line is crossed into hate by the EDL or extremist Muslims then the law comes into play.

 

Really its that simple.

Edited July 4, 2015 by Jonny5
Expanded

[melthebell]

Oh the irony.

 

Read Unbelievers post and try again. You either have free speech or you don't. We don't get to pick and choose and we certainly don't let some of the facist left choose what is or isn't acceptable.

 

When the line is crossed into hate by the EDL or extremist Muslims then the law comes into play.

 

Really its that simple.

 

huh?

thats what i was saying??

you cant pick and choose, yet certain EDL supporters think they can

[unbeliever]

huh?

thats what i was saying??

you cant pick and choose, yet certain EDL supporters think they can

 

I've no doubt that some EDL supporters are against freedom of speech for those they disagree with. They are after all among the most distasteful people around.

Myself I have no interest in joining either Islam, UAF or EDL; but I support all of them having free speech.

 

Don't get me started on supposedly "liberal" organisations imposing limits on free speech among those they disagree with. Socialists are often the first to support bans on free speech. It was, after all, Labour who introduced laws on "incitement to religious hatred". At the time some suggested that it was going to target Muslims, but in fact it seems more crafted against anti-Islam speakers.

You're not in a strong position here.

 

---------- Post added 04-07-2015 at 14:40 ----------

 

same people who say the EDL are?

 

remember the poppy burners?

 

Whereas the UAF are renowned for tolerance toward opposing viewpoints?

http://socialistworker.co.uk/art/39807/Should+fascists+be+allowed+freedom+of+speech%3F

Edited July 4, 2015 by unbeliever

[gamezone07]

This is an interesting interview.

 

Martin Smith (UAF) speaks to BBC 5 live after UAF violence in Bolton.

 

 

 

 

He is no longer the Secretary of UAF, Comrade Delta (google it) had to resign over some very very damaging allegations which also split the SWP.

[melthebell]

I've no doubt that some EDL supporters are against freedom of speech for those they disagree with. They are after all among the most distasteful people around.

Myself I have no interest in joining either Islam, UAF or EDL; but I support all of them having free speech.

 

Don't get me started on supposedly "liberal" organisations imposing limits on free speech among those they disagree with. Socialists are often the first to support bans on free speech. It was, after all, Labour who introduced laws on "incitement to religious hatred". At the time some suggested that it was going to target Muslims, but in fact it seems more crafted against anti-Islam speakers.

You're not in a strong position here.

 

---------- Post added 04-07-2015 at 14:40 ----------

 

 

Whereas the UAF are renowned for tolerance toward opposing viewpoints?

http://socialistworker.co.uk/art/39807/Should+fascists+be+allowed+freedom+of+speech%3F

 

i didnt say they were, my point was regarding EDL supporters and their barrage of freedom of speech usage

they seem to forget that the other side also have that right too, its not just a right the EDL have. some on here were the most vocal opponents of the "poppy burners" when that happened

 

what about the right of asian communities to live in peace and not be subjected to what in effect is intimidation in the guise of a protest by the EDL. As a general rule they choose routes which go through predominently asian areas.

[Harrystottle]

Freedom isn't free.

If a bunch of bigoted, small minded idiots want to share their idiocy in public we have to let them and treat them like everybody else who wants to hold a rally.

By all means, if they become violent or destructve, throw the book at them.

 

We can't bill them for policing. That would be profoundly wrong.

Freedom of speech has to include the right of people we don't like to say things we don't want to hear.

If we deviate from that principle, we become the fascists.

 

Well said.

[eckby]

UAF are far more dangerous than EDL will ever be.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/why-is-the-left-so-blinkered-to-islamic-extremism-8679265.html

Launched in 2003 as a response to the electoral activity of the British National Party, UAF spends most of its time these days organising counter demonstrations against the EDL.

 

An honourable way to pass the time, you might think.

 

UAF’s definition of what constitutes fascism, however, is a peculiar one. Not only are those advocating the resurrection of a fascistic Islamic caliphate seemingly not worth opposing, they have been actively welcomed into the UAF fold by the leadership.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/journalists/andrew-gilligan/10122496/Anti-fascists-fuel-the-fire-of-hate.html

UAF, 10 years old this year, is one of Britain’s most prominent anti-fascist organisations. It has received hundreds of thousands of pounds from the biggest trade unions, and support from dozens of mainstream politicians. Its vice-chairmen include Christine Blower, the general secretary of the National Union of Teachers, and Hugh Lanning, the deputy general secretary of the PCS civil service union.

 

Even David Cameron, when a backbench MP, signed its founding statement. It has avoided substantial scrutiny because, as in the case of Mr Brett, anyone who criticises it risks being smeared as an ally of the vile groups it opposes.

 

Of course, few causes can be more deserving than resistance to the EDL and British National Party. But the uncomfortable truth about UAF is that it contains more than a trace of fascism itself. It specialises, as seen in Oxford, in organising counter-demonstrations to any activity, or anticipated activity, by the far Right.

 

Unfortunately, UAF’s counter-demonstrations often seem to cause as much, if not more, trouble than those by the EDL and BNP.

[SHYTOT]

i didnt say they were, my point was regarding EDL supporters and their barrage of freedom of speech usage

they seem to forget that the other side also have that right too, its not just a right the EDL have. some on here were the most vocal opponents of the "poppy burners" when that happened

 

what about the right of asian communities to live in peace and not be subjected to what in effect is intimidation in the guise of a protest by the EDL. As a general rule they choose routes which go through predominently asian areas.

 

Indeed. It was rather insensitive of folk like the EDL to demonstrate in Rotherham at a time when the local council was trying to gloss over the Asian grooming gang scandal.