What does it mean to "believe in climate change"?

[MAC33]

It's his views that make sense to me.

 

Nothing or less.

[SnailyBoy]

It's his views that make sense to me.

 

Nothing or less.

 

Have you ever considered views that are backed up with evidence?

[Halibut]

It's his views that make sense to me.

 

Nothing or less.

 

'The master of Astro-theology'. In other words, he's barking.

[SnailyBoy]

'The master of Astro-theology'. In other words, he's barking.

 

A self appointed title I assume.

[hicksy3]

Are the wind/solar folk still entitled to sell their power onto the grid above market value? And are they still entitled to payments when they can provide power, but it's not needed? Those things can add up to a lot of money.

 

Critically, does it apply to off-shore wind? That's hyper-expensive. Loss of subsidy would surely kill it dead.

 

My experience as a technology writer is that most wind energy companies are acutely aware of changes in the subsidy market. They are altering products to suit. They are also exploring new markets. Globally, as one subsidy door shuts another one opens. http://bit.ly/1wf6TQC

They are also exploring new lower maintenance turbines that will dramatically reduce operating cost of offshore wind. Try typing 'smart grid' into Google and you will see just how much research is being done into problems of meeting peaks and troughs in demand from renewables. Try looking at the Energy Transfer Partnership http://bit.ly/1AIUbNe. A lot of your responses imply that you think renewable energy developers and advocates are unaware of wider problems and pretend they don't exist. Simply not the case.

You said something about needing loads of laptop batteries. Why? Laptops already have batteries in them so why would we need any more? And if you're worried where the raw materials will come from, old batteries is the obvious place to me. Interestingly, I've never been commissioned to write anything about recovery of materials from batteries. I'm pretty sure someone's working on it though.

 

 

 

 

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[unbeliever]

My experience as a technology writer is that most wind energy companies are acutely aware of changes in the subsidy market. They are altering products to suit. They are also exploring new markets. Globally, as one subsidy door shuts another one opens. http://bit.ly/1wf6TQC

They are also exploring new lower maintenance turbines that will dramatically reduce operating cost of offshore wind. Try typing 'smart grid' into Google and you will see just how much research is being done into problems of meeting peaks and troughs in demand from renewables. Try looking at the Energy Transfer Partnership http://bit.ly/1AIUbNe. A lot of your responses imply that you think renewable energy developers and advocates are unaware of wider problems and pretend they don't exist. Simply not the case.

You said something about needing loads of laptop batteries. Why? Laptops already have batteries in them so why would we need any more? And if you're worried where the raw materials will come from, old batteries is the obvious place to me. Interestingly, I've never been commissioned to write anything about recovery of materials from batteries. I'm pretty sure someone's working on it though.

 

 

 

 

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Sounds like your the person to talk to then. So what is the estimated cost to store a day's worth of electricity at an average of 30 GW, i.e. 720 million kWh; so that we can get through a day when it's neither sunny or windy and still keep the lights on and stay warm ?

 

I consider laptop batteries (perhaps I should have said Li-ION batteries, I was trying not to be over-techincal) and pumped storage, because they're where we store power at the moment.

[hicksy3]

 

Sounds like your the person to talk to then. So what is the estimated cost to store a day's worth of electricity at an average of 30 GW, i.e. 720 million kWh; so that we can get through a day when it's neither sunny or windy and still keep the lights on and stay warm ?

 

I consider laptop batteries (perhaps I should have said Li-ION batteries, I was trying not to be over-techincal) and pumped storage, because they're where we store power at the moment.

It's an invalid question. A better question might be:

What COULD the cost of storing a day's worth of power have decreased to by 2030 with better technology?

I could quantify now and I imagine it will be orders of magnitude higher than the cost of delivering fossil fuels to supply a day's worth of electricity currently. Show me yours and I'll show you mine, how much does supplying 720GWH worth of coal, oil or gas cost?

What will the cost be in 2030? Last time I looked they weren't making any more fossil fuels......

 

 

 

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[unbeliever]

It's an invalid question. A better question might be:

What COULD the cost of storing a day's worth of power have decreased to by 2030 with better technology?

I could quantify now and I imagine it will be orders of magnitude higher than the cost of delivering fossil fuels to supply a day's worth of electricity currently. Show me yours and I'll show you mine, how much does supplying 720GWH worth of coal, oil or gas cost?

What will the cost be in 2030? Last time I looked they weren't making any more fossil fuels......

 

 

 

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Actually with shale gas, the price of gas has fallen in the last few years and shale gas extraction technology makes the available supply of methane rather vast. I would expect the cost to fall further.

Still, at current prices, 720GWh of gas costs £40-80 million.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cost_of_electricity_by_source#United_Kingdom

 

So, go on then. Take the cost of say wind power per kWh and add the cost of storage per kWh and then multiply by 720 million.

[El Cid]

Actually with shale gas, the price of gas has fallen in the last few years and shale gas extraction technology makes the available supply of methane rather vast.

 

The cost of lithium ion batteries has gone from $1500 in 2000 to $300 in 2011.

[hicksy3]

I'll reply once I've thoroughly read a report on the relative economics of wind power at http://bit.ly/1G2GIWS.

I'm sure Wikipedia has a current cost/KWh of wind energy and storage for you to use though.

 

 

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