unbeliever Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 Are you all planning to buy these companies, or just seize them? If the former, where would you get the money? If the latter then how would you justify it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crookedspire Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 Are you all planning to buy these companies, or just seize them? If the former, where would you get the money? If the latter then how would you justify it? No we are all plotting and scheming right here on Sheffield Forum watch this space................ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 No we are all plotting and scheming right here on Sheffield Forum watch this space................ I'm actually asking. Replace planning with advocating if it makes you feel better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamston Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 There are also arguments against renationalisation like financing . I think if the lights start going out due to a lack of electricity and the water supply is contapinated , then that is justification for seizing . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geared Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 If we re-nationalise all these companies we'll just end up in a similar mess to Greece. A ridiculously over-sized state that can't control itself. Why are people so eager to re-nationalise things, you don't trust the government to run the things they currently do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 There are also arguments against renationalisation like financing . I think if the lights start going out due to a lack of electricity and the water supply is contapinated , then that is justification for seizing . :loopy::loopy: ---------- Post added 09-08-2015 at 20:21 ---------- If we re-nationalise all these companies we'll just end up in a similar mess to Greece. A ridiculously over-sized state that can't control itself. Why are people so eager to re-nationalise things, you don't trust the government to run the things they currently do. I don't see why you had to bring sense and reason into this meeting of the Sheffield Communist Party. Don't you know that Capitalism is responsible for everything that goes wrong in the world, the free market is a complete disaster, and that the problems with Greece are actually somehow the fault of capitalism? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cid Posted August 9, 2015 Author Share Posted August 9, 2015 (edited) Are you all planning to buy these companies, or just seize them? I am not generally in favour of nationalisation, although maybe the railways, its so complicated that at one point one franchise was in public ownership, and running well. I do believe that the state can set up none profit making organisations, and run them just as well as a private company, but we are in debt and cannot afford to buy companies. Its all down to regulation. Edited August 9, 2015 by El Cid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 (edited) I am not generally in favour of privatization, although maybe the railways, its so complicated that at one point one franchise was in public ownership, and running well. I do believe that the state can set up none profit making organisations, and run them just as well as a private company, but we are in debt and cannot afford to buy companies. Its all down to regulation. I think you mean nationalisation. When was it running well? Non-profits. I see. Have you ever had any dealings with the student loans company? They're a non-profit working at arms length for the state. You've never seen a bigger shambles. Private companies run on a sort of natural selection, like evolution. The weak, inefficient ones die and the strong efficient ones that provide good service and good value survive. That's what makes a modern civilisation work. It's no good moving things in and out of state ownership unless you have this. We have some of it with rail. More would be good, but with so much state regulation and other state involvement it's a bit of a lost cause. Non-profits monopolies are immune from this effect and so are generally dreadful. They're nationalisation by another name. Force the rail system to compete on a level playing field with other transport. Minimise government involvement in the whole business of transport. Then you'll start getting value for money. Nothing else works. Edited August 9, 2015 by unbeliever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psynuk Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 You do know, don't you that the track is already nationalised and that the track is the whole problem with the current system. Just quickly explain to me how the track side of things is the 'problem' From my somewhat limited understanding the track infrastructure was privatised along with the passenger side but the lack of care and investment led to a few derailments and deaths and that caused the track maintenance/ownership to be taken back 'in house'. serious question^^ There is also quite a problem with subsidising private companies to run the railways imo. If a company needs a subsidy to be viable then I'm not sure it should be a privately run enterprise that provides what should be a public service. http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/apr/16/rail-operators-200m-dividends-subsidy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cid Posted August 9, 2015 Author Share Posted August 9, 2015 When was it running well? Non-profits. I see. Have you ever had any dealings with the student loans company? They're a non-profit working at arms length for the state. You've never seen a bigger shambles. Private companies run on a sort of natural selection, like evolution. The weak, inefficient ones die and the strong efficient ones that provide good service and good value survive. That's what makes a modern civilisation work. It's no good moving things in and out of state ownership unless you have this. We have some of it with rail. More would be good, but with so much state regulation and other state involvement it's a bit of a lost cause. Non-profits monopolies are immune from this effect and so are generally dreadful. They're nationalisation by another name. Force the rail system to compete on a level playing field with other transport. Minimise government involvement in the whole business of transport. Then you'll start getting value for money. Nothing else works. I meant the one that was given back to the state, after the default on East Coast rail franchise that gave the francise back, and then the state was running it, making money for George Osborne. Its not just state companies that mess up, private one go bust too, and the treasury bail them out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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