What if Labour had not won?

[El Cid]

I guess you're not old enough to remember the "brain drain" of the late 1970s?

 

You sure its not a myth -

David Bowie, who went to live in Switzerland, and the Rolling Stones, who left to record in the South of France.

I would hardly call that a brain drain

 

There are now more than 3 million British-born people living abroad, of whom more than 1.1 million are highly-skilled university graduates; is that because of our high tax levels, I think not.

[unbeliever]

You sure its not a myth -

I would hardly call that a brain drain

 

There are now more than 3 million British-born people living abroad, of whom more than 1.1 million are highly-skilled university graduates; is that because of our high tax levels, I think not.

 

I'm a highly skilled university graduate and I'm not even in the 40% tax bracket after 12 years of full time work.

We're talking about the super-rich here. There aren't many of them, but they pay for a lot of the state. You'll soon notice if they decide to leave.

We've been through all this already on another thread. They left France. Why wouldn't they leave the UK for the same reasons.

 

---------- Post added 19-08-2015 at 09:49 ----------

 

Meanwhile....in the real world we had Michael Howard as prospective PM with a manifesto that was essentially pledging to spend more than Labour with an estimated £15bn of additional unfunded spending. We had George Osborne lining up to be chancellor with a wish for us to mimic Ireland (which crashed hard and fast in the crisis) against a backdrop of a Tory party calling for less regulation in the city.

 

The BofE as a regulator had itself had some major regulatory failings which was why Labour changed the system although I would agree that it was very ill-judged to make the regulatory changes they did.

 

There's no real evidence that the Tories would have heeded warnings either. The only real voice of reason in the commons in those days was Vince Cable.

 

PFI was/is stupid but not a major contributor on a macroeconomic scale to our current problems although individual sectors are starting to struggle of course.

 

I don't know where you got this figure of a trillion quid from. We would be in roughly the same situation now give or take 1 or 2% of GDP.

 

The BoE allowed one bank to get into trouble every once in a while.

They never presided over the near collapse of the whole system.

 

You're confusing volume of banking regulation with content again.

 

If our own banks had been properly regulated and we'd had 2 quarters of recession like almost everybody else rather than a year and a half, we'd be in debt to the tune of about 40% of GDP now rather than 80%. Our GDP would also be higher. That adds up to about £1trillion.

[El Cid]

 

We're talking about the super-rich here. There aren't many of them, but they pay for a lot of the state. You'll soon notice if they decide to leave.

 

The information below from the Tax Policy Center(USA), sounds unbiased. I wonder how similar things are in the uk?

 

7,000 people made more than $1 million but paid no income tax.

22,000 people made between $500,000 and $1 million but paid no income tax.

81,000 people made between $200,000 and $500,000 but paid no income tax.

381,000 people made between $100,000 and $200,000 but paid no income tax.

 

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/7000-millionaires-paid-no-income-tax-2012-9#ixzz3jFcrB6j2

 

 

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/7000-millionaires-paid-no-income-tax-2012-9#ixzz3jFcPp5Iz

[unbeliever]

The information below from the Tax Policy Center(USA), sounds unbiased. I wonder how similar things are in the uk?

 

7,000 people made more than $1 million but paid no income tax.

22,000 people made between $500,000 and $1 million but paid no income tax.

81,000 people made between $200,000 and $500,000 but paid no income tax.

381,000 people made between $100,000 and $200,000 but paid no income tax.

 

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/7000-millionaires-paid-no-income-tax-2012-9#ixzz3jFcrB6j2

 

 

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/7000-millionaires-paid-no-income-tax-2012-9#ixzz3jFcPp5Iz

 

I have no idea.

How is this relevant to the UK tax system?

Did you check what these people paid in CGT and other taxes?

[El Cid]

I have no idea. How is this relevant to the UK tax system?

Did you check what these people paid in CGT and other taxes?

 

You dont want to have an idea, try thinking about it.

 

Entrepreneur Paul Bloomfield enjoyed a lavish lifestyle including luxury homes, a helicopter and a private jet but did not submit any returns or pay a penny in tax for more than two decades, according to the BBC.

 

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2953328/The-millionaire-didn-t-pay-tax-24-YEARS-Property-investor-enjoyed-lavish-lifestyle-luxury-homes-helicopter-private-jet-without-paying-penny-HMRC.html#ixzz3jFkGzDX2

[unbeliever]

You dont want to have an idea, try thinking about it.

 

Entrepreneur Paul Bloomfield enjoyed a lavish lifestyle including luxury homes, a helicopter and a private jet but did not submit any returns or pay a penny in tax for more than two decades, according to the BBC.

 

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2953328/The-millionaire-didn-t-pay-tax-24-YEARS-Property-investor-enjoyed-lavish-lifestyle-luxury-homes-helicopter-private-jet-without-paying-penny-HMRC.html#ixzz3jFkGzDX2

 

So you found one.

 

You really don't want to see the cuts in public services and benefits which would arise if you tried to overtax the super-rich.

 

It's not something you have to work out. It's been tried. It was a catastrophe. Academic arguments about what theoretically would happen if we did this or that to the tax system are redundant if it's been tried. If it's been tried, we know what would happen.

[TJC1]

And watch them wave bye as they leave

 

Lot of these tax loopholes are being closed in a unilateral effort. The super rich are going nowhere.

 

---------- Post added 19-08-2015 at 10:56 ----------

 

Tax havens i should say...but loopholes are too.

[unbeliever]

Lot of these tax loopholes are being closed in a unilateral effort. The super rich are going nowhere.

 

Closing the odd loop-hole is a quite different matter from trying to drastically increase the amount of tax they pay.

[El Cid]

 

You really don't want to see the cuts in public services and benefits which would arise if you tried to overtax the super-rich.

 

 

I wouid be happier if they paid the same tax as you, instead of zero.

[unbeliever]

I wouid be happier if they paid the same tax as you, instead of zero.

 

That's an absurd caricature of the current tax system.

 

I pay a good chunk of my income in income tax. There's also rather a lot of NI.

Then there's council tax, and more.

 

But we can't run the level of welfare and public services we have on what I pay. I pay a bit more than enough to cover my family, but not enough to cover lower earners.

If you drive the super-rich out the the country and demand the same level of public services, they'll try and make up the difference by increasing my taxes. I'm not having that. I will honestly and genuinely move to Canada to escape it.

Then where will you get money from?

 

Just move to Greece. They already run their country the way you want. Make sure to take your furniture with you if you want to stay warm in winter.