Net migration at record high 330k

[MintPlumbing]

Re the 139 000:

does that figure include previous inward migrants, temporary workers, students after end of course, etc; or is it just British Subjects?

 

Just British citizens, 94,000 non-EU citizens and 91,000 EU citizens also left.

[Zamo]

http://www.economist.com/node/21557524

 

We're forever being told by the Tories that London is the centre of the universe,don't any immigrants live in London?

 

 

Foreigners may well have helped to mitigate the impact of the recession on London. First, migrants make an economy flexible. When demand for labour falls, some of them leave: the Polish plumber, who became a fixture of the London building trade after his country's accession to the EU, disappeared after the 2007-08 financial crisis. Second, foreigners' money has fuelled demand for services, held up property prices and kept afloat development projects that would otherwise have folded

Lower levels of regulation than in continental Europe have attracted entrepreneurs. There are reckoned to be 300,000-400,000 French people in London, making it the sixth-biggest French city. The tax policies of France's new president, François Hollande, are expected to bring still more. More than 4% of the residents of Kensington and Chelsea are now French, and the borough has a French lycée.

 

London is more welcoming than New York to rich foreigners. The attractions of the “non-dom” regime, under which the taxman ignores the offshore earnings of those who are domiciled elsewhere, have been reduced by the imposition of a levy of £30,000 a year on those who have been resident for seven years, rising to £50,000 after 12 years' residence; still, it retains its appeal for the very rich. Britain's regulators are less nosy than America's, and foreigners are generally free to buy its best properties, whereas in many Manhattan apartment blocks existing residents can veto new ones. London does not care where people's money comes from, so long as there is plenty of it.

 

Previous waves of immigrants—West Indians and South Asians—tended to be poor, whereas recent arrivals are concentrated at the top as well as the bottom: there are more investment bankers and cleaners among the foreign-born than the local population. They are also younger and better educated. “The Impact of Recent Immigration on London”, a study by the London School of Economics (LSE) published in 2008, showed that among migrants who had arrived in the previous three years, 61% had graduate-level qualifications, against 30% of native Londoners, and only 7% had no qualifications at all, against 24% of natives. Even the children of the earlier, poorer, immigrants are generally doing well (see chart 2): Bangladeshis have just overtaken whites, and black Africans are nearly on a par with them.

 

Thats your personal prejudice, data shows us white british are more likely to be on the dole than immigrants.

And the vast majority of uk citizens overall live in poor areas, work in low paid jobs.

 

So what? Does that somehow magic non-positive contributions by immigrants into positive ones? Didn't think so!

 

It isn't a case of all or nothing... migrants don't come as a job-lot. We can cherry pick and if we cherry pick to exclude the poor and uneducated it is 100% guaranteed that the net contribution made by immigrants will go up. It is simply good management practice.

 

Chinese students arent short of a few bob. You have to have money to study here, by definition.

i could go on....millions of immigrants contribute, build businesses, grow wealth.

 

No problem with foreign students coming as long as they are genuine and if they are to remain after their studies it is because we have assessed they can make a positive contribution.

 

And it is plain fantasy to say millions of immigrants are growing wealth. People in low paid jobs (and that is the majority) don't create wealth they sap it.

 

The bolded? Nonsense. That is judging people on the colour of their skin/their appearance. You are again referring to Pagehall as the de facto standard of immigration whilst ignoring those that blend in. The Roma's in Pagehall are outnumbered 2 or 3 to 1 by Chinese students I'd say, I live in Hillsborough with, in the same and nice enough road, another Dutch couple, a Fin, Italian medical doctors, Americans, Indian IT consultants and recently a German number-plate has been showing up as well so I assume they moved into one of the nice flats on Middlewood Road.

 

But you don't see that because when you walk down the street you just see nice middle-class people who all conform to Zamo's ideal. So your impression on migrants is set by Roma's because they look and behave differently.

 

Let's have a bet then to test our theories and how much we actually believe in the arguments we each make. We'll pick a one hour slot next week where we can each go wherever we want and make a video. We'll video ourselves approaching people to say we are doing a 10 second survey. We then ask them two questions. Were you born abroad. Do you earn more than £35k a year. I get a point for every yes/no answer I get and you get a point for every yes/yes answer you get. Who ever gets the least points pays the winner £10 multiplied by the difference between the two scores. Are you willing to put your money where your mouth is?

 

You won't bet because you know as well as I do that the vast majority of immigrants are at the bottom of the wealth scale and I would find them on mass whilst you'd be scratching around trying to just break into double figures.

[chalga]

So what? Does that somehow magic non-positive contributions by immigrants into positive ones? Didn't think so!

 

It isn't a case of all or nothing... migrants don't come as a job-lot. We can cherry pick and if we cherry pick to exclude the poor and uneducated it is 100% guaranteed that the net contribution made by immigrants will go up. It is simply good management practice.

 

 

 

No problem with foreign students coming as long as they are genuine and if they are to remain after their studies it is because we have assessed they can make a positive contribution.

 

And it is plain fantasy to say millions of immigrants are growing wealth. People in low paid jobs (and that is the majority) don't create wealth they sap it.

 

 

 

 

Then get your jobless,benefit pick up Brits into the low paid jobs that the poor migrants are quite willing to do,and the British Business to stop giving these poor migrants jobs,which they are quite willing to keep on doing as long as the workshy,'not enough money or good enough conditions for me to get off benefits' attitude persists............it's not a poor migrant problem,it's a benefit Brit and we want to give peanuts for wages British Business problem...........get both of them to change their ways and you won't need poor migrants will you?

[Zamo]

Then get your jobless,benefit pick up Brits into the low paid jobs that the poor migrants are quite willing to do,and the British Business to stop giving these poor migrants jobs,which they are quite willing to keep on doing as long as the workshy,'not enough money or good enough conditions for me to get off benefits' attitude persists............it's not a poor migrant problem,it's a benefit Brit and we want to give peanuts for wages British Business problem...........get both of them to change their ways and you won't need poor migrants will you?

 

There is no single problem or single solution. I don't disagree that we also need to make efforts to get British people off benefits and into work and also doing more work.

[RickyM]

There is no single problem or single solution. I don't disagree that we also need to make efforts to get British people off benefits and into work and also doing more work.

 

Zamo - is that really you in the profile picture?

 

I'm just curious.

[Zamo]

Zamo - is that really you in the profile picture?

 

I'm just curious.

 

No, it's Zammo off Grange Hill!

[RickyM]

No, it's Zammo off Grange Hill!

 

Hehe

 

I like the expression!

[I1L2T3]

Not until we leave the EU farce we dont.

 

Leaving the EU doesn't change anything

[tzijlstra]

So what? Does that somehow magic non-positive contributions by immigrants into positive ones? Didn't think so!

 

It isn't a case of all or nothing... migrants don't come as a job-lot. We can cherry pick and if we cherry pick to exclude the poor and uneducated it is 100% guaranteed that the net contribution made by immigrants will go up. It is simply good management practice.

 

 

 

No problem with foreign students coming as long as they are genuine and if they are to remain after their studies it is because we have assessed they can make a positive contribution.

 

And it is plain fantasy to say millions of immigrants are growing wealth. People in low paid jobs (and that is the majority) don't create wealth they sap it.

 

 

 

Let's have a bet then to test our theories and how much we actually believe in the arguments we each make. We'll pick a one hour slot next week where we can each go wherever we want and make a video. We'll video ourselves approaching people to say we are doing a 10 second survey. We then ask them two questions. Were you born abroad. Do you earn more than £35k a year. I get a point for every yes/no answer I get and you get a point for every yes/yes answer you get. Who ever gets the least points pays the winner £10 multiplied by the difference between the two scores. Are you willing to put your money where your mouth is?

 

You won't bet because you know as well as I do that the vast majority of immigrants are at the bottom of the wealth scale and I would find them on mass whilst you'd be scratching around trying to just break into double figures.

 

Why ask them if they earn far more than national average? Why not ask them if they have a University degree or are trying to get one? Why do we get to choose where we go and ask?

 

Not skewed at all is it? Come up with a real challenge. One where we go and talk to everybody within 1000 yards from where you live and find out how many are actually foreign-born.

[Zamo]

Why ask them if they earn far more than national average? Why not ask them if they have a University degree or are trying to get one? Why do we get to choose where we go and ask?

 

Not skewed at all is it? Come up with a real challenge. One where we go and talk to everybody within 1000 yards from where you live and find out how many are actually foreign-born.

 

The point of being able to choose where you go is that it is easy to find lots of migrants if you go to the places where people that are towards the bottom of the wealth scale live, work and shop. If you go to the places where those doing better live, work and shop then you will be scratching around. For every one migrant you find making a positive contribution by going to the better places to live, work or shop, I will probably find 10. You try to pretend it is an a nice even mix of migrants and that I overstate the level of non-contributors. If you want to pick Waitrose whilst I go to The Moor then I wish you all the best.

 

Why ask if they have a degree? You can buy they cheap enough in most of the countries where immigrants come from. That is another problem. People coming from North Africa and the Middle East come from places where corruption is the norm, sexism is the norm, homophobia is the norm, religious extremism is a problem etc, etc. They bring with them cultural baggage, which is not tackled by demanding integration. People might overlook some of these negatives if they were sufficiently offset by a financial contribution that made us wealthier... but there is no offset. Most migrants offer us nothing and we need to weed them out and only welcome those that do.