What is a benefits scrounger?

[Mister M]

I thought we were just offering our own opinions on what constitutes a benefits scrounger, not what other people think.

 

How can anyone know how much is defrauded from the benefits system?

You can know how many people have been caught but you can't know anything about the people that get away with it.

How can anyone know how much goes unclaimed, to know you would need to know the personal circumstances of everyone and the government doesn't have that information, if they did there would be no need to fill out forms to claim benefits and no fraud.

 

Yes but giving opinions context is important - especially since shame and guilt prevent many from claiming what they're entitled to.

With regards to your other points all the information is googlable.

 

---------- Post added 31-08-2015 at 20:30 ----------

 

Between 2011 and 2014 approximately 2,000,000 people died in England.

That's pproximately 10,000 people every week, many will have been claiming benefits, so its highly likley that the 2,380 would have died anyway, it's just 11 a week out of the 10,000 a week that die.

 

Although the DWP consistently blocked attempts to reveal such figures until they were forced to by the Information Commissioner, Iain Duncan Smith lied to Parliament claiming such figures didn't exist. As the Government like to say 'If you've got nothing to hide, then you've got nothing to worry about'.

 

Also read the circumstances of those that did die shortly after having their benefits cut - David Clapson and Mark Wood are just 2 that spring to mind.

I think after reading their cases you'd be reluctant to shrug you're shoulders & say 'they would've died anyway'.

[adrea]

Yes but giving opinions context is important - especially since shame and guilt prevent many from claiming what they're entitled to.

No idea what this as to do with me giving my opinion on the question posed in the first post.

 

 

 

With regards to your other points all the information is googlable.

Googlable yes, but just like you it can't answer the question, because you nor anyone one else can know the extent of fraud, you can know about detected fraud but not undetected fraud.

 

 

 

Although the DWP consistently blocked attempts to reveal such figures until they were forced to by the Information Commissioner, Iain Duncan Smith lied to Parliament claiming such figures didn't exist. As the Government like to say 'If you've got nothing to hide, then you've got nothing to worry about'.

They probably hide figures like that because they upset people that don't understand them.

 

 

 

Also read the circumstances of those that did die shortly after having their benefits cut - David Clapson and Mark Wood are just 2 that spring to mind.

I think after reading their cases you'd be reluctant to shrug you're shoulders & say 'they would've died anyway'.

 

There as to be sanctions against people that miss appointments or don't look for work, but local benefits staff, family and friends would have known more about his circumstances than the government, there are also hardship funds for those kinds of cases.

[dafodil]

The benefits system is a joke. Whats the point of capping it even? That money doesnt go to people it goes into a private landlords pocket

 

Its really stupid.

 

---------- Post added 31-08-2015 at 13:56 ----------

 

And im not blaming the tories for this...what on earth were new labour doing for 17 years??

Build more social housing [even some would do] the fair rents would then go back to the council instead of the greedy buy to let brigade who charge extortionate rents so as to obtain property virtually for free.

[Mister M]

No idea what this as to do with me giving my opinion on the question posed in the first post.

 

Then Have a deeper think

 

Googlable yes, but just like you it can't answer the question, because you nor anyone one else can know the extent of fraud, you can know about detected fraud but not undetected fraud.

 

According to reports I've read DWP do keep figures on the take up of benefits. With regards to Fraud, the Work & Pensions Select Committee publishes such figures regularly. I suggest you write to them with regards to your point about detected & undetected fraud.

They probably hide figures like that because they upset people that don't understand them.

 

<REMOVED> - they hide figures because they don't want to upset people. Never read anything so ridiculous in my life! Is that why Iain Duncan Smith lied to Parliament, saying that such figures didn't exist because he didn't want to hurt peoples feelings? Oh yes, IDS is known for his sensitivity and humanity

 

There as to be sanctions against people that miss appointments or don't look for work, but local benefits staff, family and friends would have known more about his circumstances than the government, there are also hardship funds for those kinds of cases.

 

No ATOS knew the circumstances of these 2 individuals, as they knew of others.

I don't think you give a damn about the vulnerable and sick dying at a rate of knots after being kicked off benefits. Probably why you're so quick to defend the Government on this.

 

And by the way. You've not got me fooled Smithy. I know your posting style, your spelling errors, your twists in logic and your single minded desire to have the last word.

I've outed you.

Edited September 1, 2015 by esme
quote tags & masked swearing

[adrea]

No ATOS knew the circumstances of these 2 individuals, as they knew of others.

I don't think you give a damn about the vulnerable and sick dying at a rate of knots after being kicked off benefits. Probably why you're so quick to defend the Government on this.

 

And by the way. You've not got me fooled Smithy. I know your posting style, your spelling errors, your twists in logic and your single minded desire to have the last word.

I've outed you.

 

Using someones death as a political weapon to bash the government is sick and twisted, and who is Smithy?

[Mister M]

Using someones death as a political weapon to bash the government is sick and twisted, and who is Smithy?

 

The Government have known full well of the impact of the WCA for years. MPs from all sides of the house told them often enough. You don't seem to mind that many sick and vulnerable people have died as a consequence of such a policy. But you object strongly to people pointing it out.

You know full well who Smithy is. I think 'Loraward' is acquainted with him as well.

[woodmally]

With an entire economic system based on benefits, I was wondering what is the definition of a benefit scrounger?

 

Is it someone who plays the system?

Are landlords benefits scroungers, for accepting subsidies?

are people in work who accept in-work benefits?

Would you accept benefits if you were entitled to them and not feel bad about it?

 

Finally, what sensible solution do you propose to stop this merry go round or do you accept nothing can be done?

 

I would say those that accept benefits they are not entitled to as well as those that can help themselves but chose not to. The regulars on Jeremy Kyle being an example.

[esme]

Mod Note

 

When quoting other users please do not insert your own comments within the quote.

[RonJeremy]

I see plenty of people wandering around with walking sticks they quite obviously don't need - all but swinging the thing. I find myself wryly smiling at them. They in my book are undeserving benefits recipients.

The families that are third and fourth generations of families all on benefits could even be described by some as scroungers. They are obvious to me and will be to others, even to those in denial.

[Bonzo77]

Truth is, individual benefit scroungers are few and far between. We shouldn't even be talking about them. There's bigger fish to fry.