Taxpayer support

[Cyclone]

Like I've said several times, you've swallowed the PR from the government spin machine hook, line and sinker.

 

Here, have a look at this, see if it helps you get some perspective.

 

http://images.huffingtonpost.com/2013-03-25-392DifferentKindsofFraud01-thumb.jpg

 

http://www.cas.org.uk/features/myth-busting-real-figures-benefit-fraud

 

---------- Post added 17-10-2015 at 09:26 ----------

 

I haven't made a comment about an article or report, I asked a question which no one can answer, you claim the answer is in a report that you have read, but you refuse to answer the question. My conclution is that there isn't a report which contains the answer to my question because if such a report existed you would simply answer the question.

 

You refuse to read the report and expect someone else to do it for you.

Scared you might learn something?

[I1L2T3]

We all have to face up to the fact that tax credits as they are are unsustainable. We can't afford to carry on like this. It's a ridiculous system. Utterly ridiculous. Look at this:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34548733

 

This woman voted Tory at the election. Which bit of £12bn a year of welfare cuts in the Tory manifesto did she fail to grasp?

 

She voted for cuts to her own income and now she is crying on national TV. It gets better though. She runs her own business from home that makes no profit at all. The woman crying on TV is effectively being paid to do her hobby at home and pretend its a business, being paid by us and in receipt of enough income from the state to run a household. That is not work.

 

Perhaps millions of people have taken this route into being self-employed with pretend businesses. The worse thing is they now see themselves as bona fide business people and some seem to have developed a kind of affinity with the Tories as a result. But they never made any connection that their tax credits were actually benefits and Osborne was going to go after them. Yet they helped deliver a Tory victory. Laughable.

[RonJeremy]

Like I've said several times, you've swallowed the PR from the government spin machine hook, line and sinker.

 

Here, have a look at this, see if it helps you get some perspective.

 

http://images.huffingtonpost.com/2013-03-25-392DifferentKindsofFraud01-thumb.jpg

 

http://www.cas.org.uk/features/myth-busting-real-figures-benefit-fraud

 

---------- Post added 17-10-2015 at 09:26 ----------

 

 

You refuse to read the report and expect someone else to do it for you.

Scared you might learn something?

 

I haven't swallowed any government spin. I haven't seen the government spin. You put a couple of links that refer to benefit fraud and how it relates to uncollected taxes. I'm not sure of the relevance.

The OP is about legal benefits being claimed, not about fraud. Fraud is a problem, but not totally relevant to the thread.

My problem on this thread is with the system, not with individuals fraudulently claiming benefits or people evading tax for that matter.

[truman]

and what if the going rate is nmw and the employer is only offering 16 hours a week that worker then gets his/her wages topped up by working tax credits( taxpayers). so in your question are we talking one man bands ? are we talking multi nationals ? come on Truman i cant actually believe that you haven't seen these companies operating this way to make more profit for themselves:roll:

 

If the employer has 40 hours a week of work to offer how is it in their interest to have 2 part timers do it rather than than 1 full time worker?

[999tigger]

If the employer has 40 hours a week of work to offer how is it in their interest to have 2 part timers do it rather than than 1 full time worker?

 

Am sure youve asked this question already and I answered it.

 

Advantages of employing pt workers.

1. More flexible arrangement as in you can target their usage for when you need them, rather than solid block of work.

2. P/t workers earn less and as such it means employers can avoid paying national insurance if they keep the hours low. Thats 12%.

3. P/t workers have fewer employment rights, they take longer to acquire and are thus easier to fire.

[RonJeremy]

Am sure youve asked this question already and I answered it.

 

Advantages of employing pt workers.

1. More flexible arrangement as in you can target their usage for when you need them, rather than solid block of work.

2. P/t workers earn less and as such it means employers can avoid paying national insurance if they keep the hours low. Thats 12%.

3. P/t workers have fewer employment rights, they take longer to acquire and are thus easier to fire.

 

Very little of this is true - and it works both ways.

 

We are talking about part time workers (Not ZHC employees).

1. Most PT workers have set days - ie in a job share One person works mornings 5 days a week the other afternoons. or one works Monday Tuesday weds til 1 the other weds, thurs, fri. Some jobs only need 20 hours work to fulfil the requirements. That would be a PT job.

2. PT workers have equal pay. It is the law. I accept there is some saving in EE and ER NI contribution, but this is massively outweighed by the hassle of employing additional people with all the baggage that goes with employing people.

3. They have exactly the same employment rights. This is errant nonsense. They are no easier to fire. If only it was easy to fire hopeless, useless workers without the risk of a malicious tribunal made up of lefties, unionist and other people with nothing better to do.

 

Sorry to burst your bubble

[the_bloke]

Is this the person you mentioned previously??

 

No, it's someone else (I do know more than one person claiming benefits, possibly more than can be said for a lot of the people who so vigorously defend them). I've told her to get clarification as it sounds rubbish, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's true.

 

She runs her own business from home that makes no profit at all. The woman crying on TV is effectively being paid to do her hobby at home and pretend its a business, being paid by us and in receipt of enough income from the state to run a household. That is not work.

 

No it isn't, and she's in a better position than most to directly control her own income. Strange how taxes paying for her to keep a failing business model going gets derision in this case, but people are calling for the nationalisation of the steel and coal industry - taxes to pay for a failing business model.

 

Even Corbyn had a dig at this woman on his Facebook page, he seemed far more interested in pointing out she was a Conservative voter than actually proposing a fix to her issue. Opposition for the sake of opposition.

[tinfoilhat]

No, it's someone else (I do know more than one person claiming benefits, possibly more than can be said for a lot of the people who so vigorously defend them). I've told her to get clarification as it sounds rubbish, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's true.

 

 

 

No it isn't, and she's in a better position than most to directly control her own income. Strange how taxes paying for her to keep a failing business model going gets derision in this case, but people are calling for the nationalisation of the steel and coal industry - taxes to pay for a failing business model.

 

Even Corbyn had a dig at this woman on his Facebook page, he seemed far more interested in pointing out she was a Conservative voter than actually proposing a fix to her issue. Opposition for the sake of opposition.

 

She's in no more in a position to control her own income than the zhc teenager at sports direct. If she doesn't get the orders, she doesn't get the work, she doesn't get paid. Clinging onto tax credits as an guaranteed income stream isn't clever. It's nice to have to help get it off the ground but it has to be short term.

[ricgem2002]

Very little of this is true - and it works both ways.

 

We are talking about part time workers (Not ZHC employees).

1. Most PT workers have set days - ie in a job share One person works mornings 5 days a week the other afternoons. or one works Monday Tuesday weds til 1 the other weds, thurs, fri. Some jobs only need 20 hours work to fulfil the requirements. That would be a PT job.

2. PT workers have equal pay. It is the law. I accept there is some saving in EE and ER NI contribution, but this is massively outweighed by the hassle of employing additional people with all the baggage that goes with employing people.

3. They have exactly the same employment rights. This is errant nonsense. They are no easier to fire. If only it was easy to fire hopeless, useless workers without the risk of a malicious tribunal made up of lefties, unionist and other people with nothing better to do.

 

Sorry to burst your bubble

1 pt workers doing the hours you say will be entitled to wtc again wages topped up by the taxpayer (more profit for

the business)

2 so you accept that there is saving to the employer in ee and er ni contributions again(more profit for the business)

3 why did you leave out zhc workers its still the same people on these hours again getting wages topped up by the taxpayer(more profit for the business:roll:

[JFKvsNixon]

We all have to face up to the fact that tax credits as they are are unsustainable. We can't afford to carry on like this. It's a ridiculous system. Utterly ridiculous. Look at this:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34548733

 

This woman voted Tory at the election. Which bit of £12bn a year of welfare cuts in the Tory manifesto did she fail to grasp?

 

She voted for cuts to her own income and now she is crying on national TV. It gets better though. She runs her own business from home that makes no profit at all. The woman crying on TV is effectively being paid to do her hobby at home and pretend its a business, being paid by us and in receipt of enough income from the state to run a household. That is not work.

 

Perhaps millions of people have taken this route into being self-employed with pretend businesses. The worse thing is they now see themselves as bona fide business people and some seem to have developed a kind of affinity with the Tories as a result. But they never made any connection that their tax credits were actually benefits and Osborne was going to go after them. Yet they helped deliver a Tory victory. Laughable.

 

I thought exactly the same thing about her and her business. I understand if she was talking about her business have a hard time at the moment, but she doesn't seem to understand that she's meant to live from the income from her business, or get a job around the business.

 

My wife started a business last year, she understands that it takes time for a business to mature and become profitable, so she kept her job to maintain an income. It means that she has to work bloody hard, but that's how it should be.