Zamo Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 No reform is needed, if I know of any IS sympathisers or extremists I will report them to the authorities as I'm sure other Muslims will do too. That isn't enough. You need to stop producing them. The extremists aren't freaks of nature but freaks of nurture. The cultural and religious beliefs that Muslims propagate and perpetuate disproportionately creates violent extremists and that is unacceptable. If by reform you mean denounce our religion and stop praying and start eating bacon butties then you will be waiting till hell freezes over. The religion is not the problem otherwise you would have over a billion Muslims going round attempting to kill non Muslims. By reform I mean the 'mainstream' putting distance between themselves and the extremist camp. The beliefs Muslims currently preach and teach are the same as those of the extremists. The main difference being that the mainstream limited their propagating activity to preaching and teaching offspring whilst the extremists seek to propagate by imposing murderous violence on all and sundry. The 'mainstream' needs to tone it all down and move further away from the extremist camp to prevent so many straying into it. This backlash you talk about doesn't bother me, I lived through the era when **** bashing was a pastime in England. When you talk of backlashes against Muslims you do realises that all you achieve is alienating more Muslims. I was sat at a mates house with other non Muslims and one of the friends brothers was in France at the time of the terror attacks last night, not one of them blamed me or my religion for the attacks.. Not everyone holds right wing views like yourself.. RIP to all the innocent people killed in this attack, it is unjustifiable and totally against what I believe in... The backlash will take different forms. Firstly, there is the political backlash... and it has already started. For years people have been saying they are uncomfortable with the level of immigration and polls consistently show most people (around 75% in the UK) want it reduced. Despite that it has increased and with it has come financial, social, criminal and terrorist problems, which obviously hasn't done much for multicultural relations. This is causing a backlash against the the sort of liberal politics that has given us these problems and as such nationalism and far right politics are gaining support. In the UK, UKIP has grown to the extent that it won the last European election, in France the the NF are now the biggest party as are the Swedish Democrats in Sweden. In Poland and Switzerland they recently elected anti-immigration parties into power and the Progress Party in Norway is getting bigger and bigger. In Germany they have PEGIDA growing and attacks against migrants increasing rapidly. It is a pattern that can be seen across Europe and the tempo increases with every attack that is effectively the by-product of Muslim immigration. If all this 'doesn't bother you' then you are a fool because it should be of huge concern to you and everyone else. Secondly, the **** bashing of the 70's and 80's that you lived through will start to reappear. The racists will kick it off and Muslims will fight back. As soon as that happens it is inevitable that innocent people get caught up in it, it escalates quickly and fuels the political backlash. Violence will not only alienate Muslims but non-Muslims too and drive huge wedge between communities. I dread to think where it will take us. Thinking that what happened in Germany in the 1930's and in the Balkans in the 1990's cannot happen again is dangerous and naive. We are the same species and it only takes the right conditions for the animal within to out... it feels like the conditions are becoming right. I am sure it is most touching that your non-Muslim friends didn't blame you or your religion for the Paris attacks. It doesn't change what is happening. It also doesn't mean their position will not change if conflict starts... look how friends and neighbours turned on each other during the Balkans conflict. You are taking false comfort from it. I offer a warning of what I think is going to happen and what is needed to stop it. I don't do that because I want the far right taking over Europe but because I don't. If Muslims, encouraged by blinkered liberals, fail to heed the warning then what more can I do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exxon Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Ill take it off your hands if you like. That doesn't really answer the question but when will you collect. I'm in Barlborough. ---------- Post added 15-11-2015 at 11:18 ---------- The backlash will take different forms. Firstly, there is the political backlash... and it has already started. For years people have been saying they are uncomfortable with the level of immigration and polls consistently show most people (around 75% in the UK) want it reduced. It certainly vindicates Cameron's policies on controlling our borders. The hoardes entering Europe are finding borders closing. Britain at least is an island and can keep border security. In the longer term it will increase support for leaving the EU so that we are able to control our borders to those who already are EU residents. We will also make alliances with folk we would normally not consider friends in order to confront a common ememy. Russia will find rather more target information passing its' way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gomgeg Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 It's been reported this morning that over 700 have gone to Syria to join ISIS and 400 of those have now returned. It's also said that not enough resources are available to monitor them all. As it now seems inevitable that without action, what's just happened in Paris will happen here, and we are now at war with terrorists so we should bring back internment and forget about terrorists and potential terrorists human rights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halibut Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 It's been reported this morning that over 700 have gone to Syria to join ISIS and 400 of those have now returned. It's also said that not enough resources are available to monitor them all. As it now seems inevitable that without action, what's just happened in Paris will happen here, and we are now at war with terrorists so we should bring back internment and forget about terrorists and potential terrorists human rights. Ridiculous idea. It would play right into the terrorists hands and drive otherwise sensible people towards extremism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 It's been reported this morning that over 700 have gone to Syria to join ISIS and 400 of those have now returned. It's also said that not enough resources are available to monitor them all. As it now seems inevitable that without action, what's just happened in Paris will happen here, and we are now at war with terrorists so we should bring back internment and forget about terrorists and potential terrorists human rights. I guess this is where we need the full cooperation and support of the Muslim community. It is closed off really to outsiders. We don't understand how the community functions and there is no simple way of getting involved. The community will know who the returnees are and they have a duty to help prevent a repeat of the Paris attacks. There will be others who have not been to Syria who could also pose a significant threat so the community needs to be dealing with them too. We don't need to start locking people up. We need to get smarter. ---------- Post added 15-11-2015 at 11:42 ---------- Ridiculous idea. It would play right into the terrorists hands and drive otherwise sensible people towards extremism. Indeed. What do people think will happen if you put the 400 worst extremists in a building together? It'd be like a finishing school for terrorists. We can see what happens already in prisons with radicalisation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubaidani13 Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 It's been reported this morning that over 700 have gone to Syria to join ISIS and 400 of those have now returned. It's also said that not enough resources are available to monitor them all. As it now seems inevitable that without action, what's just happened in Paris will happen here, and we are now at war with terrorists so we should bring back internment and forget about terrorists and potential terrorists human rights. wholeheartedly agree, internment is one of the answers anyone who is linked or that sympathizes should be sent to some sort of camp. human rights should not extend to terrorists or their supporters ---------- Post added 15-11-2015 at 11:45 ---------- I guess this is where we need the full cooperation and support of the Muslim community. It is closed off really to outsiders. We don't understand how the community functions and there is no simple way of getting involved. The community will know who the returnees are and they have a duty to help prevent a repeat of the Paris attacks. There will be others who have not been to Syria who could also pose a significant threat so the community needs to be dealing with them too. We don't need to start locking people up. We need to get smarter. ---------- Post added 15-11-2015 at 11:42 ---------- Indeed. What do people think will happen if you put the 400 worst extremists in a building together? It'd be like a finishing school for terrorists. We can see what happens already in prisons with radicalisation. my you are in dream world that aint never going to happen, there is more support behind closed doors of the " communities" than we know:roll: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Regret Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 wholeheartedly agree, internment is one of the answers anyone who is linked or that sympathizes should be sent to some sort of camp. human rights should not extend to terrorists or their supporters Ha! Internment? What a stupid idea. ---------- Post added 15-11-2015 at 11:46 ---------- my you are in dream world that aint never going to happen, there is more support behind closed doors of the " communities" than we know:roll: How do you know that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Equato Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 US and UK flags get burnt all the time in protest. We don't like it any more that Muslims like Quran burning but we'd never murder people for it. Hmmm! i wouldn't like to put that to the test by burning a bible on the crowded main street of a town in Mississippi or Alabama, when a load of the locals say I'm going to go home and get something, I doubt it would be a pack of crumpets to toast in the flames. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Very true. ISIS followers are happy to kill Muslims in other sects, e.g. Shi'as. There have been reports of ISIS holding mass executions of other Muslims. There are even massive divisions within single sects. People often ask why the moderate Muslims don't stand up to the extremists. That won't wash with is IS situation as much of the resistance to IS is being taken on by the Kurds who are also predominantly Sunni Muslims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gomgeg Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Ridiculous idea. It would play right into the terrorists hands and drive otherwise sensible people towards extremism. What sort of 'sensible people' are going to be 'driven towards extremism'? That seems to be a contradiction of terms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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