Berberis Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 exactly its about a world that is supposed to be equal....it isnt. No not "exactly" as you have completely missed the point. If you had read the book you quote you would know Animal Farm is about how COMMUNISM doesn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WiseOwl182 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Not sure I understand your post...are you agreeing they were fakes? Or saying there are 2 genuine passports issued to 2 different people?!?! As I understand it, the terrorist was using a Syrian passport that may or may not be fake, but his finger prints were verified along with other migrants passing through Greece. The same passport (copy of) has been found being used by another migrant. Whether or not the passport is a fake does not change that the terrorist got to Europe via Greece amongst the migrants and was then free to roam throughout the Schengen countries without additional checks (which may have picked up his passport as being fake). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vague_Boy Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 You obviously haven't because Animal farm is not about capitalism. It's not the main theme but it is a theme. Orwell's criticism of capitalism is more subtle, but it is clear throughout the story that the humans -- who all practice general capitalist policies -- are cruel and abusive. The animals try to escape this through their own work, but the animal society proves untenable and Napoleon begins commerce with the other farms. The farmers first try to cheat the animals, and then start working with the pigs. One farmer jokes: "If you have your lower animals to contend with," he said, "we have our lower classes!" This bon mot set the table in a roar... LINK I would cite the ending of the book, where the previously antagonistic local farmers come to look round the farm: He believed that he was right in saying that the lower animals on Animal Farm did more work and received less food than any animals in the county. Indeed, he and his fellow visitors today had observed many features which they intended to introduce on their own farms immediately. He would end his remarks, he said, by emphasizing once again the friendly feelings that subsisted, and ought to subsist, between Animal Farm and its neighbours. Between pigs and human beings there was not, and there need not be, any clash of interests whatever. Their struggles and their difficulties were one. Was not the labour problem the same everywhere? Too subtle for some perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerousedd Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 I thought animal farm was about communism? i.e everybody is equal but some are more equal that others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubaidani13 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 I thought animal farm was about communism? i.e everybody is equal but some are more equal that others. exactly!!!! which is what some are calling for? equality for all, open world borders equality of wealth, housing jobs opportunities etc etc but long term it doesnt work:roll: a bit like communism ---------- Post added 17-11-2015 at 19:14 ---------- No not "exactly" as you have completely missed the point. If you had read the book you quote you would know Animal Farm is about how COMMUNISM doesn't work. i think maybe its you that missed it:hihi: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halibut Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 exactly!!!! which is what some are calling for? equality for all, open world borders equality of wealth, housing jobs opportunities etc etc Is it your position that because something might seem hard to achieve it isn't worth striving towards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubaidani13 Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 Is it your position that because something might seem hard to achieve it isn't worth striving towards? No not at all, i always strive to be the best i can, but i have achievable goals not unachievable fantasies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtkate Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 As I understand it, the terrorist was using a Syrian passport that may or may not be fake, but his finger prints were verified along with other migrants passing through Greece. The same passport (copy of) has been found being used by another migrant. Whether or not the passport is a fake does not change that the terrorist got to Europe via Greece amongst the migrants and was then free to roam throughout the Schengen countries without additional checks (which may have picked up his passport as being fake). Thank you for clarifying, I was trying to find out that info and couldn't. Schengen made this 1 attack easier, and over the past few years has helped Europe generate billions of euros in extra revenue for it's citizen. One swallow does not a summer make. We cannot use extreme cases as a basis for removal of Schengen. There are other arguments for it's removal as well, but there should NOT be a kneejerk. Easy to say as a Brit sat safely outside of the zone mind you. ---------- Post added 18-11-2015 at 09:03 ---------- exactly!!!! which is what some are calling for? equality for all, open world borders equality of wealth, housing jobs opportunities etc etc but long term it doesnt work:roll: a bit like communism I said we need to get 'greater' equality of wealth. Completely different to equal wealth. If you've got someone who can earn 50 times more working in a minimum wage job in the UK compared to being a doctor in Sudan then you have a problem with open borders. However, if that doctor could earn twice in the UK as a doctor than in Sudan you likely don't have the same issue due to money. Nothing about everyone being equal here, just 'more equal' than at present. As I said, we are so far off this that I can never see fully open borders being anything more than a pipe dream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berberis Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 i think maybe its you that missed it:hihi: You are wrong and you obviously have never read the book. Animal Farm according to Orwell, reflects events leading up to the Russian Revolution (a Tsarist autocracy) of 1917 and then on into the Stalin era in the Soviet Union (Communism). There is no reference to Capitalism in the book what so ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Arthur Posted November 18, 2015 Author Share Posted November 18, 2015 You are wrong and you obviously have never read the book. Animal Farm according to Orwell, reflects events leading up to the Russian Revolution (a Tsarist autocracy) of 1917 and then on into the Stalin era in the Soviet Union (Communism). There is no reference to Capitalism in the book what so ever. In some respects Dubaidani13 is right but he / she has no idea why because they have only got a few memories of a 1950's cartoon. Few people will have read it. They probably rely on a few vague memories of the animated version, which is actually very good but a few memories of cartoon pigs and a horse doesn't quite get Orwell's message across. The basic message for the plebs is about communism but there's an undertone that reflects Orwell's understanding of the impossibility of changing general human behaviour in any context which is where the success of capitalism and its unavoidable dangers comes in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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