Eric Arthur Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 The NHS is a mess. It's pathetic admin system alone guarantees it will be a mess. Comparing it to the American medical system and offering that as some kind of reason to think the NHS isn't a mess, is like saying muds OK cos it's better than dog***t. Here we go par for the course placation by a habitual apologist. The NHS is so far removed from 'perfect' that to use the term in connection with it, is absurd. I do agree that you can say the same ('it's not perfect') about any large organisation, but, unlike the NHS, supermarkets are actually fit for purpose, and, while I am less tolerant to long waits than most, the fact is, I can get from one end of a supermarket queue to another, without starving to death, unlike the NHS, with waiting lists that are so long, that there's a fair chance the patient will die of their illness before they get seen. I just wanted to quote this in support of every single word written. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeMaquis Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 What is the NHS's inflation figure? Who much do all these new treatments cost? How much extra does the NHS need to cover the cost of the ageing population? My opinion isn't simplistic it is based on all the available information.... If you have all the available information then why are you asking the above questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim1 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 It would depend on what your issue with her care was? Did the 3 days happen at the weekend, and you think that is the fault of the junior doctors? My gran was released at 6pm Saturday. (We had to wait until 6pm as the idiots with clip boards were sorting her medication out) She still has not received the medication that pathetic excuse for a doctor promised me. And I mean promised! he would sort by Tuesday morning! They only let us take her home as they were giving her the new medication. We have been to the GP today and he is as lost as us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutty27 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 If you have all the available information then why are you asking the above questions. After an extensive search I have concluded that that information isn't available, it might be that I just can't find it so if you can answer the question I will have access to even more information from which to form my opinion, if you can't then we are both in the same boat, having to form an opinion in the absence of said information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 The NHS is a mess. It's pathetic admin system alone guarantees it will be a mess. Comparing it to the American medical system and offering that as some kind of reason to think the NHS isn't a mess, is like saying muds OK cos it's better than dog***t. Here we go par for the course placation by a habitual apologist. The NHS is so far removed from 'perfect' that to use the term in connection with it, is absurd. I do agree that you can say the same ('it's not perfect') about any large organisation, but, unlike the NHS, supermarkets are actually fit for purpose, and, while I am less tolerant to long waits than most, the fact is, I can get from one end of a supermarket queue to another, without starving to death, unlike the NHS, with waiting lists that are so long, that there's a fair chance the patient will die of their illness before they get seen. A lot of that is just nonsense from the Tory handbook of NHS attacks Got any evidence to back any of this up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFKvsNixon Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 (edited) The NHS is a mess. It's pathetic admin system alone guarantees it will be a mess. Comparing it to the American medical system and offering that as some kind of reason to think the NHS isn't a mess, is like saying muds OK cos it's better than dog***t. Here we go par for the course placation by a habitual apologist. The NHS is so far removed from 'perfect' that to use the term in connection with it, is absurd. I do agree that you can say the same ('it's not perfect') about any large organisation, but, unlike the NHS, supermarkets are actually fit for purpose, and, while I am less tolerant to long waits than most, the fact is, I can get from one end of a supermarket queue to another, without starving to death, unlike the NHS, with waiting lists that are so long, that there's a fair chance the patient will die of their illness before they get seen. I wear the badge of NHS apologist with pride, as you should wear your badge of not really understanding what I was saying with a little shame. I said the NHS is not perfect!!!!! Maybe you should post on what I actually say instead of what you think I said. Anyway, your making yet another logical mistake in a long line of others, as I was drawing the attention to research that compared the results of healthcare in the two countries. Remember when you're supporting the supermarkets that you're talking about organisations that sold horse meat labeled as other animal meats. Edited February 18, 2016 by JFKvsNixon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna B Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 The NHS is a mess. It's pathetic admin system alone guarantees it will be a mess. Comparing it to the American medical system and offering that as some kind of reason to think the NHS isn't a mess, is like saying muds OK cos it's better than dog***t. Here we go par for the course placation by a habitual apologist. The NHS is so far removed from 'perfect' that to use the term in connection with it, is absurd. I do agree that you can say the same ('it's not perfect') about any large organisation, but, unlike the NHS, supermarkets are actually fit for purpose, and, while I am less tolerant to long waits than most, the fact is, I can get from one end of a supermarket queue to another, without starving to death, unlike the NHS, with waiting lists that are so long, that there's a fair chance the patient will die of their illness before they get seen. I agree that it's a mess, but why do you think it got into this state? (Genuine question.) Personally I think it's when they tried to introduce competition rather than co-operation, and the many managers it needed to administer it. What do you think? More importantly, how do you think it can be sorted out? I would be happy to pay a bit more, but then the waste would drive me mad, so I would need to be reassured that we were getting value for every penny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Arthur Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 A lot of that is just nonsense from the Tory handbook of NHS attacks Got any evidence to back any of this up? A lot of that is just nonsense from the Labour handbook of Tory attacks. Got any evidence to back any of this up? ---------- Post added 18-02-2016 at 06:56 ---------- On the subject if the NHS being a basketcase. http://news.sky.com/story/1643885/1100-nhs-never-disasters-in-four-years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ukdobby Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 In November on a Sunday night my mother collapsed,she was rushed to the Northern where the guy on duty said she'd got a virus and sent her home,1 hour later she went unconscious and was then rushed back in,they had to wake a surgeon up and bring him in to operate on a burst heart valve,the surgeon said if this had not happened she would have died that night due to internal bleeding,she is now progressing slowly but this tells me the nhs needs to run to full capacity 7 days a week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 A lot of that is just nonsense from the Labour handbook of Tory attacks. Got any evidence to back any of this up? ---------- Post added 18-02-2016 at 06:56 ---------- On the subject if the NHS being a basketcase. http://news.sky.com/story/1643885/1100-nhs-never-disasters-in-four-years Problem with that is I don't support Labour. There's plenty of evidence that indicates that for the amount of spend on the NHS we still get good value for money. The system is flawed in many ways and nobody really disputes there isn't room for improvement. But to consistently denigrate the entire system is unfair. When it comes to the crunch you are not going to be happy when you start having to pay hundreds of quid a month to private insurers for your health care. That is what you seem to want though. And you can do better than a Murdoch-controlled source. ---------- Post added 18-02-2016 at 08:12 ---------- In November on a Sunday night my mother collapsed,she was rushed to the Northern where the guy on duty said she'd got a virus and sent her home,1 hour later she went unconscious and was then rushed back in,they had to wake a surgeon up and bring him in to operate on a burst heart valve,the surgeon said if this had not happened she would have died that night due to internal bleeding,she is now progressing slowly but this tells me the nhs needs to run to full capacity 7 days a week. Sorry to hear about your mum and glad she is on the mend. Misdiagnosis does happen and its no consolation to you but it happens in every health system in the world. Is the NHS any worse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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