mafya Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 But they are also playing Turkey by keeping migrants there. thats 2.1m refugees that could easily be crossing over. The alternative is if you dont wnat them as an ally you get them as an enemy. The plane incident is short term. ---------- Post added 01-12-2015 at 21:35 ---------- Yes I prefer it to a website which supports 9/11 as a conspiracy. Your argument was about oil and allegations. This one is about the PKK. Time will tell if its true and they really have duped the Americans in certain regards, but they were desperate to use Incerlik. As ive said before I'd like it if the Kurds managed to get an independent homeland, but its unlikely to happen because there will be further war from the countries who they are currently part of. You point out that most of the attacks are against the Kurds, but thats not much different than the Russians putting in eve greater attacks against the non isis anti Assad opposition forces that the US supports. Why would you care Mafya you obviously dont like anyone else except Assad and Russia. I care because I'm a british citizen and England is my country, I'm not against the west as you are trying to insinuate. Even the guardian warned that turkey is double dealing = http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/if-turkey-chooses-erdogan-at-the-polls-this-weekend-isis-will-gain-strength-and-the-refugee-crisis-a6715491.html In the Syria conflict I'm going with Russia and Assad because we the west are being duped by double dealing turkey.. How do you think Isis oil gets over the turkey bored unhindered! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L00b Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 (edited) Its 2 sides of the same coin. Its the same with Africa. If the EU chooses to pay nothing then the natural flow of things is that economic migrants and refugess will move and the people on the borders will have no reason to stop them. £2.2 billion £s is peanuts for the EU compared with the associated costs of them arriving. Its a negotiated settlement. Settling what? Are you really expecting a few €bns here and there to stem the Saharan and Middle Eastern migratory flows? I don't. It will have about as much effect as peeing on a violin to try and get a tune out. Just you watch, migrant crisis 2.0:summer of '16 edition. It will dwarf this year's. There's multiples of that amount already to be had in people smuggling all around the Med, and Turks are far from the least active in that respect. Edited December 1, 2015 by L00b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
999tigger Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 Settling what? Are you really expecting a few €bns here and there to stem the Saharan and Middle Eastern migratory flows? I don't. It will have about as much effect as peeing on a violin to try and get a tune out. Just you watch, migrant crisis 2.0:summer of '16 edition. It will dwarf this year's. There's multiples of that amount already to be had in people smuggling all around the Med, and Turks are far from the least active in that respect. Im not in the negotiations, but they obviously believe they are getting something out of it. Keeping as many in camps in Turkey are ones that dont have to be dealt with in the EU. If the camps arent funded, then there really will be an even bigger migratory tidal wave as they wont be going back to Syria any time soon. Its not a case of whether next years migrant crisis is bigger, more that it could have been even worse without keeping the ones in camps there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SqueakyPete Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 If this does transpire that Turkey have been receiving oil by convoy's of trucks,will this not beg the question..."how did the U.S.A and associates with all their surveillance equipment,not spot anything after a whole year in Syria?". Its not like oil trucks are inconspicuous things are they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 If this does transpire that Turkey have been receiving oil by convoy's of trucks,will this not beg the question..."how did the U.S.A and associates with all their surveillance equipment,not spot anything after a whole year in Syria?". Its not like oil trucks are inconspicuous things are they? They knew all along and now the excuses are coming out like they didn't want to cause civilian casualties and didn't want to cause environmental problems. Like that ever stopped them before. Truth is they need ISIS. And the truth is if Cameron had got approval in 2013 we would have been working alongside ISIS and the Americans against Assad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantom309 Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 On the one o'clock BBC news today there was " Dave " informing parliament for the case to bomb and use the the forces already there as ground troops , then the BBC correspondent Frank Gardner saying there is up to 10 different rebel groups fighting in Syria and the free Syrian army as no one in overall command so I am confused to how "Dave " can even think that they will be the allies ground troops to fight ISIS. If the unknowns are to be factored in such as how many troops does Iran and Russia have supporting the Assad regime this seems to be a dangerous situation as there is too many different participants wanting different out comes and each group having different priorities to what should be done first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betterman Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 On the one o'clock BBC news today there was " Dave " informing parliament for the case to bomb and use the the forces already there as ground troops , then the BBC correspondent Frank Gardner saying there is up to 10 different rebel groups fighting in Syria and the free Syrian army as no one in overall command so I am confused to how "Dave " can even think that they will be the allies ground troops to fight ISIS. If the unknowns are to be factored in such as how many troops does Iran and Russia have supporting the Assad regime this seems to be a dangerous situation as there is too many different participants wanting different out comes and each group having different priorities to what should be done first. The question is. Can any of them be worse than ISIS, if not it doesn't matter which of them claimes the land that ISIS occupies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retep Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Could it be the hottest Christmas on record, http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/624421/Russian-Doomsday-plane-nuclear-war-launch-two-weeks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tzijlstra Posted December 4, 2015 Author Share Posted December 4, 2015 Could it be the hottest Christmas on record, http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/624421/Russian-Doomsday-plane-nuclear-war-launch-two-weeks Express. Have they suggested that this will be the coatldest winter ever yet? Or indeed that 50,000 dogs will be made homeless this winter due to Osborne cutting tax credits? Or that 200,000 soldiers face the axe at work because Cameron is affiliating with terrorists in Northern Ireland? No? Yes? Anybody actually care? Might as well read the Onion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retep Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 Express. Have they suggested that this will be the coatldest winter ever yet? Or indeed that 50,000 dogs will be made homeless this winter due to Osborne cutting tax credits? Or that 200,000 soldiers face the axe at work because Cameron is affiliating with terrorists in Northern Ireland? No? Yes? Anybody actually care? Might as well read the Onion. This from a former librarian with a degree from the wizard, tut, tut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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