Hogg Posted November 29, 2015 Share Posted November 29, 2015 David Cameron is coming under increasing pressure to sack his very close friend, Lord Feldman, over the scandal of Elliot Johnson's suicide. It is surprising how unfortunate Cameron has been in his friendships. I don't need to name the three very famous friends he has already had to 'distance himself' from. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/12021991/Tory-chairman-should-quit-over-bullying-scandal.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamston Posted November 29, 2015 Share Posted November 29, 2015 Not at all, there are plenty of areas where I understand less. I notice how you are unable to answer questions and what are quite reasonable areas. Its certainly the areas the PM, the police, his father and the coroner are looking into. Clearly if im wrong, then you are free to point it out with some reasoned discussion. I don't understand your point . I have already stated the coroner is investigating the circumstances surrounding the tragic young man's death . What questions can I answer ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassity Posted November 29, 2015 Share Posted November 29, 2015 No one was accused of anything . With hindsight , no doubt his friends , me and other family members would have acted differently . With hindsight , no doubt all those who came into contact with Elliot Johnson would have acted differently . We could all walk on eggshells with everyone we come into contact with , but people would still throw their lives away by committing suicide . I doubt very much the alleged bullying will be the sole reason why Elliot Johnson killed himself . My symapathies go out to Elliot Johnson's family , those being blamed for his suicide and the unfortunate person who discovered him on the railway track . And no one is blaming anyone for Johnson's death, otherwise it would be a murder inquiry.. What isn't clear exactly is the amount of abuse and how sustained it was..which is likely to be a factor in him taking his own life. You don't actually have to be hands on, but you can be complicit through your own actions whether morally or physically. Personally I have no sympathy for bullies in any form. As for his family and the person who found him I will agree...as they were victims also . All you've done is try to mitigate the actions of Clark because Johnson was unable to control his own destiny..not surprising if you understand how suicide works. 'With hindsight" is a copout. Any wrong doer can use that after the fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamston Posted November 29, 2015 Share Posted November 29, 2015 And no one is blaming anyone for Johnson's death, otherwise it would be a murder inquiry.. What isn't clear exactly is the amount of abuse and how sustained it was..which is likely to be a factor in him taking his own life. You don't actually have to be hands on, but you can be complicit through your own actions whether morally or physically. Personally I have no sympathy for bullies in any form. As for his family and the person who found him I will agree...as they were victims also . All you've done is try to mitigate the actions of Clark because Johnson was unable to control his own destiny..not surprising if you understand how suicide works. 'With hindsight" is a copout. Any wrong doer can use that after the fact. Elliot Johnson's father is blaming several people for his son's death . From my understanding the Police have not completed their enquires and the Coroner has not delivered any verdicts yet . Mark Clarke has denied any wrong doing . I think bullying is exagerrated in all areas of society and some people claim they have been bullied as an excuse for their own shortcomings . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister M Posted November 29, 2015 Author Share Posted November 29, 2015 Elliot Johnson's father is blaming several people for his son's death . From my understanding the Police have not completed their enquires and the Coroner has not delivered any verdicts yet . Mark Clarke has denied any wrong doing . I think bullying is exagerrated in all areas of society and some people claim they have been bullied as an excuse for their own shortcomings . Why would people use bullying as an excuse for their own shortcomings? Most people who I've heard talk about their experiences as children often blame themselves for what happened, as if somehow it's their fault, and take responsibility when they shouldn't do. That is at odds with your description of people looking for an easy cop out, and thus blame bullying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassity Posted November 29, 2015 Share Posted November 29, 2015 Elliot Johnson's father is blaming several people for his son's death . From my understanding the Police have not completed their enquires and the Coroner has not delivered any verdicts yet . Mark Clarke has denied any wrong doing . I think bullying is exagerrated in all areas of society and some people claim they have been bullied as an excuse for their own shortcomings . No, he's accusing certain people for their failure to act in a proper way which allegedly played a part in his own son's suicide.. Exaggerated? That was a bit of a leap. I do of course understand "own shortcomings" as an excuse to defer loathsome actions by apologists, like I do with.. " He wasn't a man" " he was a weakling" " Get a grip"...all terms used by the ignorant. Believe me Schapps would not have resigned if the suggestion was in anyway untrue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamston Posted November 29, 2015 Share Posted November 29, 2015 No, he's accusing certain people for their failure to act in a proper way which allegedly played a part in his own son's suicide.. Exaggerated? That was a bit of a leap. I do of course understand "own shortcomings" as an excuse to defer loathsome actions by apologists, like I do with.. " He wasn't a man" " he was a weakling" " Get a grip"...all terms used by the ignorant. Believe me Schapps would not have resigned if the suggestion was in anyway untrue I think you are doing a little nitpicking regarding the father . The leap was in response to your earlier comment regarding bullies . Why should I believe you ? I think Grant Shapps previous misdemeanours contributed to his decision to resign over this tragic incident . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flanker7 Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Saville at the BBC was 'hiding in plain sight' everyone knew what he was and turned the other way. It's becoming more and more obvious that Mark Clarke was the same in the Conservative party after Sayeeda Warsi has revealed that she a letter to the Chair of the party complaining about Clarke in January of this year. Saville was successful, powerful and knighted but Clarke hardly fits that description, so why did he get away with it for so long? Is it the Conservative attitude with regard to people in positions of power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoatwobbler Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Straw man, Eric. I'll tell you who is a disgrace: Mark Clarke for one, Grant Shapps for another. What about Michael Green? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassity Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 What about Michael Green? What about him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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