Will Cameron have the guts to offer his MPs a free vote on Syria?

[sgtkate]

This is correct. Nicky Morgan Con minister was on Question Time/Question Time Extra and she confirmed it was a whipped vote.

 

Then my respect goes up for the Tory MPs who voted against it as they will now likely suffer consequences for not towing the line.

[Hesther]

That's absolutely awful. What an absolute <swear word>...we really are starting to see party divisions on conduct.

 

It is disgusting all the furore the press have made and Conservatives saying Corbyn must give MPs a free vote, and then Tories use the whip and NOTHING is said.

 

This is what Corbyn is having to deal with every day. Absolute hypocrisy from the press and the government and its supporters. It will only get worse after the Oldham by election result, as the media/establishment are frightened to death as Corbyn is his own man and will not be dictated to by them.

 

There should be an investigation in to the bias of the media at least.

 

---------- Post added 03-12-2015 at 22:23 ----------

 

Then my respect goes up for the Tory MPs who voted against it as they will now likely suffer consequences for not towing the line.

 

Absolutely, especially after Cameron's 'terrorist sympathisers' comment. He is coming across to me as a big bully boy.

Edited December 4, 2015 by Hesther

[unbeliever]

There were 7 Conservative MPs who voted against and a further 7 who abstained.

It's not uncommon in the Conservative party for a few MPs to defy the whips like this.

They almost certainly won't be de-selected and I seriously doubt anybody will threaten to kill them.

[Hesther]

There were 7 Conservative MPs who voted against and a further 7 who abstained.

It's not uncommon in the Conservative party for a few MPs to defy the whips like this.

They almost certainly won't be de-selected and I seriously doubt anybody will threaten to kill them.

 

Like, the Tory Syria vote was almost certainly not likely to be whipped? Watch this space.

[sgtkate]

There were 7 Conservative MPs who voted against and a further 7 who abstained.

It's not uncommon in the Conservative party for a few MPs to defy the whips like this.

They almost certainly won't be de-selected and I seriously doubt anybody will threaten to kill them.

 

What is the issue with de-selection? I totally support it at every general election as long as the incumbent is allowed to run for the nomination, then if the local people they represent still think they are doing a good job then they get re-nominated. Pretty simple I'd have thought.

[unbeliever]

What is the issue with de-selection? I totally support it at every general election as long as the incumbent is allowed to run for the nomination, then if the local people they represent still think they are doing a good job then they get re-nominated. Pretty simple I'd have thought.

 

The issue arises when the party leader can effectively sack MPs for not doing what he/she says. The MPs work for and foremost for their constituents and not for the party leader.

 

I think we've discussed the idea of primary elections before. I think it would do wonders for the accountability of MPs.

[Hesther]

This serves to highlight that the media have far too much unchecked power in this country and when they fear their own interests are under threat there are no depths to which they will not stoop.

[Eric Arthur]

It is disgusting all the furore the press have made and Conservatives saying Corbyn must give MPs a free vote, and then Tories use the whip and NOTHING is said.

You have got it wrong. The story was that MP's were going to defy the whip, not that they were going to follow it. Following the whip has never even been a problem.

[sgtkate]

You have got it wrong. The story was that MP's were going to defy the whip, not that they were going to follow it. Following the whip has never even been a problem.

 

It is when the opposition were in the news repeatedly for supposedly not allowing a free vote, and when the government do EXACTLY the same there is not a thing said. It's almost like Murdoch, a massive donor to the Tory party, controls the media isn't it?

[unbeliever]

It is when the opposition were in the news repeatedly for supposedly not allowing a free vote, and when the government do EXACTLY the same there is not a thing said. It's almost like Murdoch, a massive donor to the Tory party, controls the media isn't it?

 

The reason that the question of the Labour whip was making headlines was that shadow ministers were threatening to resign over it. Government ministers were not, so it was not an issue. I can remember plenty of new stories about Conservative MPs defying their whip.

 

Unless it's a confidence matter (an issue which would force the PM to resign) a whipped vote is not an existential matter for the government and small rebellions by back-bench MPs are common and tolerated.

Ministers and most especially cabinet ministers are not allowed to defy the whip, it's a matter of collective responsibility. If an MP who is also a Minister or perhaps a PPS wants to vote against the government, they have to resign from the government first and become a back-bencher.

 

The same conventions apply to the opposition and the shadow ministers.

 

The reason so much fuss was made about this is that shadow ministers were determined to vote against the Labour whip and were prepared to resign in order to do so. In the end Corbyn reluctantly allowed a free vote so that shadow ministers could defy him without resigning first.