PeteMorris Posted December 1, 2015 Author Share Posted December 1, 2015 Banks don't have their own consumer/retail electronic payment methods (other then BACS and bank transfers), these are still administered mostly by card schemes (VISA, MasterCard, AMEX, etc.) and card scheme fees (processing, fraud, replacement cards, etc.) are loud. Apple Pay is one way of reducing these fees, and accessorily the (non-trivial) influence of card schemes in the electronic payment industry, particularly in respect of card fraud (since customers using Apple Pay don't need to carry their cards, which therefore don't get lost/misused/etc.) There is also a whole host of hardware-/system-related (and again, non-trivial) cost savings associated with doing away with physical payment cards over time. Yes...I can see that logic and it does actually make sense...Do you think it might make the snatching of phones more prevalent, than they already are?...Yes I know most peoples phones are locked and a thief would need to have access to a pin number or something...But thieves do tend to be one step ahead of security these days.... ---------- Post added 01-12-2015 at 10:09 ---------- You need to dig into your wallet to get your card to pay via contactless, so it's more convenient than that. Most people don't have a problem using their phone in public. It's one of the points of having a mobile phone that you're willing to use it out of the house, so for them that's not an issue. Actually, I have to confess, I've had a contactless payment card since 2009 and never once used that method to pay for anything...But of course that's just me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L00b Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 Yes...I can see that logic and it does actually make sense...Do you think it might make the snatching of phones more prevalent, than they already are?...Yes I know most peoples phones are locked and a thief would need to have access to a pin number or something...But thieves do tend to be one step ahead of security these days....Thieves can't be faster than the 3G/4G network and its interface with Apple's and banks' and others' servers, through which a smartphone can (already) be told quasi-instantly to die -and stay dead- wherever it happens to be, as soon as it is reported lost or stolen. Unlike a contactless payment card, the misuse of which might not get detected for hours (though card schemes' and banks' "pattern sniffers" are getting quite good these days). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMorris Posted December 1, 2015 Author Share Posted December 1, 2015 Thieves can't be faster than the 3G/4G network and its interface with Apple's and banks' and others' servers, through which a smartphone can (already) be told quasi-instantly to die -and stay dead- wherever it happens to be, as soon as it is reported lost or stolen. Unlike a contactless payment card, the misuse of which might not get detected for hours (though card schemes' and banks' "pattern sniffers" are getting quite good these days). Do you need a wifi connection or a phone signal to use it?...A lot of stores I've been in, especially the bigger ones, my phone signal dies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 Really?...Silly question then...What's the point? For Apple? It's a USP, something that there phones could do first and which increases the utility of the phone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WiseOwl182 Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 You need to dig into your wallet to get your card to pay via contactless, so it's more convenient than that. Most people don't have a problem using their phone in public. It's one of the points of having a mobile phone that you're willing to use it out of the house, so for them that's not an issue. I have a pin code screen lock on my phone, so pulling out my phone and unlocking it, and then potentially having to load up an app too, takes me a similar time or longer than taking the deliberately well placed card from my wallet. In both cases a few seconds but even so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 (edited) Do you need a wifi connection or a phone signal to use it?...A lot of stores I've been in, especially the bigger ones, my phone signal dies... No, the phone doesn't need a connection to the network anymore than your bank card does. The main advantage over a card is actually that phones will be used for high value contactless, because a phone is seen as more secure than a bit of plastic. The phone will still need unlocking with a pin or fingerprint or whatever in order to make the payment. Drop your contactless card and someone can spend £19.99 several times before it finally asks for a pin. ---------- Post added 01-12-2015 at 10:25 ---------- I have a pin code screen lock on my phone, so pulling out my phone and unlocking it, and then potentially having to load up an app too, takes me a similar time or longer than taking the deliberately well placed card from my wallet. In both cases a few seconds but even so... You don't have to launch the app, so long as NFC is turned on, the app will launch automatically. Apple pay might be used for paying at the supermarket where the cost is £120, contactless can normally only be used for up to £20 (and soon that's to go up to £30). Edited December 1, 2015 by Cyclone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFKvsNixon Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 I have a pin code screen lock on my phone, so pulling out my phone and unlocking it, and then potentially having to load up an app too, takes me a similar time or longer than taking the deliberately well placed card from my wallet. In both cases a few seconds but even so... You don't even have to unlock your phone. Whilst its locked you press the home button once and press it again to hold it down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMorris Posted December 1, 2015 Author Share Posted December 1, 2015 You don't even have to unlock your phone. Whilst its locked you press the home button once and press it again to hold it down. I presume you mean with a finger print locked phone?....Otherwise that's a recipe for disaster. ---------- Post added 01-12-2015 at 10:33 ---------- No, the phone doesn't need a connection to the network anymore than your bank card does. The main advantage over a card is actually that phones will be used for high value contactless, because a phone is seen as more secure than a bit of plastic. The phone will still need unlocking with a pin or fingerprint or whatever in order to make the payment. Drop your contactless card and someone can spend £19.99 several times before it finally asks for a pin. ---------- Post added 01-12-2015 at 10:25 ---------- You don't have to launch the app, so long as NFC is turned on, the app will launch automatically. Apple pay might be used for paying at the supermarket where the cost is £120, contactless can normally only be used for up to £20 (and soon that's to go up to £30). Does that mean it's constantly running in the background, draining what is already a pain in the arse with phones (ie battery longevity) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obelix Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 No, the phone doesn't need a connection to the network anymore than your bank card does. If the transaction is above the floor limit then you will need a connection to the banking system. That's provided by the PoS terminal though, regardless of if it's a chip, contactless or NFC. The real beauty of NFC is the increased processing power and much increased security that gives you hence the floor limit can be raised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WiseOwl182 Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 You don't even have to unlock your phone. Whilst its locked you press the home button once and press it again to hold it down. I still don't think that will save me any time over a contactless card. In both cases I'm getting something out of my pocket, with the card I'm picking it out of the wallet and with the phone I'm pressing and holding buttons. I can't see the advantage unless and until I no longer need to carry a wallet, and we're not there yet by a long shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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