Campaign grows to switch the building of HS2 station to Sheffield city

[tinfoilhat]

28 minutes ago, Baron99 said:

So the entire project has been given the go ahead.  Currently, £102 billion will have to be borrowed so that I can get to London, 40 minutes earlier, sometime around the best estimate of 2040 - if I live that long & suddenly have a longing to take regular trips to the capital. 

 

£102 billion, up from £56 billion from 2015, so God knows what the final cost will be?  Our bit, if it does go ahead, is not going to start being constructed until 2030.

 

It's not going to help any current northern commuters with their daily struggle.  This is where the money should be spent, updating the lines & infrastructure of the major northern cities to improve the journey & connectivity.  That will generate the economic prosperity of the North & retain & bring the talent & expertise to the North. 

It's about capacity, not speed.

[tinfoilhat]

There's going to be "minimal changes" on the route to Leeds. Any guesses on what that will be ?

[dutch]

17 minutes ago, tinfoilhat said:

There's going to be "minimal changes" on the route to Leeds. Any guesses on what that will be ?

Thanks, no surprise. This HS2 thing sounds just like trumps wall to me.

[Robin-H]

1 hour ago, Baron99 said:

So the entire project has been given the go ahead.  Currently, £102 billion will have to be borrowed so that I can get to London, 40 minutes earlier, sometime around the best estimate of 2040 - if I live that long & suddenly have a longing to take regular trips to the capital. 

 

£102 billion, up from £56 billion from 2015, so God knows what the final cost will be?  Our bit, if it does go ahead, is not going to start being constructed until 2030.

 

It's not going to help any current northern commuters with their daily struggle.  This is where the money should be spent, updating the lines & infrastructure of the major northern cities to improve the journey & connectivity.  That will generate the economic prosperity of the North & retain & bring the talent & expertise to the North. 

No it's not. 

 

If adjusted to 2019 prices, the figures set out in the Chairman’s Stocktake are as follows:

Phase One: £40.4bn to £43bn, against a budget equivalent of £30.4bn

Phase 2a: £4bn to £4.5bn, against a budget equivalent of £4.2bn

Phase 2b: £36.3bn to £40.3bn, against a budget equivalent of £27.8bn

Total for HS2 project: £80.7bn to £87.7bn, against a budget equivalent to £62.4bn

 

The figure in excess of £100b is assuming that the figures will end up being 15-20% higher than those estimates, and doesn't take into account the real opportunities to reduce costs on Phase 2b.

 

That's not to say the figure won't end up being over £100b in today's money, but that's not the cost currently. 

[geared]

2 hours ago, Baron99 said:

£102 billion, up from £56 billion from 2015, so God knows what the final cost will be?  Our bit, if it does go ahead, is not going to start being constructed until 2030.

I'm thinking it'll be closer to £200bn when all is said and done.

 

Talking to a friend in a Rail engineering firm it's well known in the industry that no-one is paying attention to costs.

Companies are submitting the most ludicrous quotes for work and they're accepted without question every single time.

Edited February 11, 2020 by geared

[Robin-H]

50 minutes ago, geared said:

I'm thinking it'll be closer to £200bn when all is said and done.

 

Talking to a friend in a Rail engineering firm it's well known in the industry that no-one is paying attention to costs.

Companies are submitting the most ludicrous quotes for work and they're accepted without question every single time.

I highly doubt that. Bidders for work have to submit tenders. The only reason to submit ludicrous quotes for work would be if you didn't want to get the job. 

[RiffRaff]

3 hours ago, tinfoilhat said:

It's about capacity, not speed.

So why isn't it "HC2"?

[Mister Gee]

1 hour ago, West 77 said:

Mr Johnson has vowed to restore discipline. I assume that includes not agreeing to ludicrous high quotes that would not be tolerated when the private sector is funding the cost of work in big projects.
 

Never fear, his guru says PJ Masks is on it.

 

[tinfoilhat]

1 hour ago, RiffRaff said:

So why isn't it "HC2"?

I don't know, I didn't name it.

 

We could have called it "let's build a new line to increase capacity but use crappy old slow trains so ladies don't faint". But I don't think that sounds as swish when you have the Chinese with trains doing 247mph now.

[Baron99]

6 hours ago, tinfoilhat said:

It's about capacity, not speed.

I'll give you the increased capacity but the main point of the HS2 publicity still seems to be the reduced times it will take to get to London. The current rail line infrastructure isn't going to disappear, the HS will run in tandem, over on its own dedicated line as far as I can see. 

 

Ignoring the Sheffield angle, this morning it was stated that you could have the standard, over-crowded rolling stock coming down the west coast line from Scotland (Glasgow) to Manchester, then transfer to the HS line for your final high speed journey into the capital. 

 

And if its going to benefit the north, why leave out the likes of Doncaster, Newcastle & Edinburgh? 

 

Why this mania for the nacessity of a high speed line to London?  I can understand a substantial number of people commuting on a daily basis into London from Birmingham, Bristol & the south coast but the number wanting to commute from Sheffield on a daily basis must be minimal? 

 

Whenever I've seen passengers moan about overcrowding, it's not been on the likes of the Master Cutler but on the routes 30 odd miles or so from London & commuters trying to get to their work in Sheffield from the likes of Leeds, Manchester, Huddersfield & vice-versa.  This is where any improvements should have started.  At a more regional level. 

 

And who says we will need this increased capacity in 20+ years, given that many organisations are now turning to increased use of IT, using  cheaper, more environmentally options such as teleconferencing & allowing staff to work from home?

 

One of my grandchildren, works for the Home Office in Sheffield & they all but  stopped the travelling to & from London years ago, except for the all but the really important meetings.  Many of the staff now have access to HO laptops with the option of working from home.