Campaign grows to switch the building of HS2 station to Sheffield city

[foxy lady]

We've been through this before though.

 

How do we increase the current infrastructure without building new lines? It's not feasible to just add a couple of lines to existing track with out causing all sorts of problems.

 

So if we're going to build new track, we might as well make it high speed track.

 

I think its you that has been through it before but simply lack vision. We have modern technology to control trains and the system. We can increase the number of passenger trains, run them closer together, and with increased power, also increase seating capacity on each. We can invest in line improvements.

 

We no longer need coal trains on the lines which will also free up capacity and reduce the number of branch lines crossing the high speed lines.

 

£30 billion buys a lot of improvements.

[Guest busdriver1]

No I dont. It should connect the major settlements.

 

Its planned to serve the Sheffield city REGION. For your information that covers more than just Sheffield. Siting it in an area where there is room for re-development makes more sense than siting it in a built up city centre. (Even a small one like Sheffield).

The worst thing about this sheffield city region is the name. it makes people think it only includes Sheffield and places outside that little area are not involved, well sorry but they are, wake up and recognise it.

[Cyclone]

We could save £31 billion and allow convenient trains to arrive in the centre of Sheffield. Can you imagine how much improvement you can make to the current main line, to the passenger confort and to the rolling stock by spending half that amount on them? Can you imagine how bad our existing trains and roads would be in 30 years if £31 billion of the transport budget is diverted to building HS2?

 

This was investigated as one of the options, as was using the money to improve the road network.

 

---------- Post added 18-05-2016 at 07:35 ----------

 

So if you have to drive to get to Hope in order to get a train to Sheffield, so you can get a train to Meadowhall, so you can get a train to London, you would probably be better off driving to Chesterfield and taking the direct train from there.

 

I'm not sure what you're expecting. HS2 can't guarantee to improve the journey time for someone in every village in the country.

 

Looking at it though, Hope to Meadowhall on the train will take just about the same time as Hope to Chesterfield in the car (ignoring bad traffic which is likely to add a lot of time).

And then HS2 from Meadowhall will be quicker than the regular train from Chesterfield.

 

---------- Post added 18-05-2016 at 07:38 ----------

 

That's a pretty idiotic thought. I'd take a taxi because I'd want to be in the city centre, not at the city centre railway station trying to get a taxi to where I wanted to be. You don't get out much do you?

Clearly I get out more often than you.

I have actually travelled by train, changed in Sheffield and then gone on to Meadowhall. Not idiotically jumped in a taxi, to take 4 times as long and pay 4 times as much.

I've travelled to London many times. On one occassion along with our local MP. It is the train that takes the strain. An extra 5 or 10 minutes on a direct train isn't really an issue. Changing trains, changing platforms and waiting for connections is.

You must have found it very inconvenient, walking down to the Victoria Line, then changing to the Jubilee line to get to the houses of parliament. And you know what happens when you get there, it isn't directly outside. You have to walk. You even have to cross the road at Vauxhall bridge. Outrageous.

[foxy lady]

This was investigated as one of the options, as was using the money to improve the road network.

 

---------- Post added 18-05-2016 at 07:35 ----------

 

 

I'm not sure what you're expecting. HS2 can't guarantee to improve the journey time for someone in every village in the country.

 

Looking at it though, Hope to Meadowhall on the train will take just about the same time as Hope to Chesterfield in the car (ignoring bad traffic which is likely to add a lot of time).

And then HS2 from Meadowhall will be quicker than the regular train from Chesterfield.

 

---------- Post added 18-05-2016 at 07:38 ----------

 

Clearly I get out more often than you.

I have actually travelled by train, changed in Sheffield and then gone on to Meadowhall. Not idiotically jumped in a taxi, to take 4 times as long and pay 4 times as much.

 

You must have found it very inconvenient, walking down to the Victoria Line, then changing to the Jubilee line to get to the houses of parliament. And you know what happens when you get there, it isn't directly outside. You have to walk. You even have to cross the road at Vauxhall bridge. Outrageous.

 

In your hamfisted way you have very nearly made a point.

 

The speed of the train is not an issue as you sit there in relative comfort, drinking coffee and using the laptop. What makes the difference is the door to door time. So if you need to travel for an hour to get to the HS2 station, hang around 15 minutes waiting to it to leave then travel around London for an hour and a half once you arrive, saving 15 minutes on the train journey is irrelevant.

 

What is not irrelevant is that 95% of the population will have to travel further to get to an HS2 station than they would to get to a regular mainline station. For 95% of the population HS2 will be a white elephant. However it will inconvenience far more people than it benefits and cost them £31 billion and rising for the privilege. £31 billion which will largely come out of the budget of transport systems that they do use.

[Annie Bynnol]

... So if I want to go to Manchester I would be better going to Totley and taking the slow train. If I wanted to go to London I'd be better off going to Chesterfield and taking the slow train. If I wanted to go to Birmingham I'd be better off going to Sheffield and taking the slow train. Can you see a pattern emerging here?

 

Please can you explain why you would use Chesterfield station to go to London but Sheffield station to go to Birmingham?

 

Trains which are now Hope Valley to Meadowhall are non-stop at the moment.

HS2 and improvements already mentioned will increase the potential for more trains that stop on their way to Meadowhall.

HS2 allows for a new MML station at Dore.

HS2 gives the potential for the Chesterfield to Meadowhall or Sheffield "old road" routes and stations to be re used.

 

HS2 "frees up" the potential of the current Victorian system providing more routes, more stations, more connections to meet the continuing demand and growth of rail travel and hopefully reduce the increase in demand for motorway building through the middle of places like Renishaw.

[Cyclone]

In your hamfisted way you have very nearly made a point.

 

The speed of the train is not an issue as you sit there in relative comfort, drinking coffee and using the laptop. What makes the difference is the door to door time. So if you need to travel for an hour to get to the HS2 station, hang around 15 minutes waiting to it to leave then travel around London for an hour and a half once you arrive, saving 15 minutes on the train journey is irrelevant.

 

What is not irrelevant is that 95% of the population will have to travel further to get to an HS2 station than they would to get to a regular mainline station. For 95% of the population HS2 will be a white elephant. However it will inconvenience far more people than it benefits and cost them £31 billion and rising for the privilege. £31 billion which will largely come out of the budget of transport systems that they do use.

 

I get the feeling that you don't have the faintest idea what you're talking about.

 

Further is totally irrelevant, journey time is what matters to individuals. But to the public generally, capacity is also important. I don't want a fast Sheffield to London service on a train where there is only standing room when I get on.

 

Repeating your argument to make it clear how wrong it is, the M25 is irrelevant to 95% of the population, as is pretty much every individual motorway. But the network overall is very important.

Edited May 18, 2016 by Cyclone

[foxy lady]

 

Looking at it though, Hope to Meadowhall on the train will take just about the same time as Hope to Chesterfield in the car (ignoring bad traffic which is likely to add a lot of time).

And then HS2 from Meadowhall will be quicker than the regular train from Chesterfield..

 

But only if you live at Hope Railway Station. Most people in the Hope Valley don't. Therefore they would have to make a trip to the station before they could wait for a train, which adds time, so they may as well go to Chesterfield. Unlike travelling in Sheffield getting to Chesterfield Station is relatively traffic free.

Also trains from Hope to Meadowhall tend to run about 1 every 2 hours so it isn't really likely that you will find one at a time you want to travel.

 

---------- Post added 18-05-2016 at 10:05 ----------

 

I get the feeling that you don't have the faintest idea what you're talking about.

 

 

I get the feeling that you don't have the faintest idea what you're talking about.

[alchemist]

So if you are travelling to Sheffield you may as well get off at Derby thus saving 20 minutes on your rail journey time.

 

If that is your choice, getting off at birmingham would no doubt save you even more time But as I say, a journey is only from one hub to another. Slightly off topic but just as relevant, would you want airports to be in city centres to save the taxi journey time?

[foxy lady]

Please can you explain why you would use Chesterfield station to go to London but Sheffield station to go to Birmingham?

 

 

That's quite simple. Many of the Birmingham trains from Sheffield don't stop at Chesterfield which makes it difficult to get onto them.

[alchemist]

So if the HS2 doesn't build a spur from it's mainline to exactly where everybody could possibly ever want to go in Sheffield, you believe it's going to be a waste of money.

 

You also seem to believe that we'd be better off paying to replace all the track, bridges and stations to accommodate your idea of double decker trains, that won't take people exactly to where they want to go.

 

Dont forget that in every other city centre apart from sheffield the train runs to every house and office