Anna B Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Happiness starts with water. To buy/produce/harness water you need wealth. wealth = happiness (well a start to it anyway) Poverty is often the cause of great unhappiness, but wealth does not necessarily equate to happiness. You know what I mean. There is plenty of wealth sloshing about to buy/produce/harness water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxy lady Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 No, it's not rubbish. Hunger is political. It is caused by poverty and inequality not scarcity. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/eric-holt-giminez/world-hunger_b_1463429.html The world already produces one and a half times enough food to feed everyone on the planet. That's enough to feed 10 Billion people (which experts believe the world's population will eventually peak at.) World population is currently 8 billion. The biggest problem is people cannot afford to buy food, and that can happen anywhere. That's great, apart from the fact that to ship this food around the world would take resources away from producing it. The fuel needed would increase polution to the point where agriculture became impossible in places. None of that addresses the income and life style sacrifices you would need to make to live in this cloud cukoo land of yours. If it's what you want get yourself off to live in Somalia. I'll stick with driving my car to the supermarket to buy food, flicking a switch to turn on the light, and flushing the loo when necessary. Enjoy you mud hut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quik Posted January 10, 2016 Author Share Posted January 10, 2016 Why? Aren't we supposed to be civilised? Is it beyond the wit of man to come up with an equitable solution? Can't we put some of these brilliant brains and fantastic technology to work to solve these sorts of problems? Do we all need 'an abundance?' Don't we all simply all need 'enough?' As long as status is judged by what you have, rather than the kind of person you are, we are going to continue to have these problems. Happiness is nothing to do with wealth, but friends, family, health, and doing good. Most of us on this website are unlikely to be hugely wealthy by UK standards. However by global standards we are all cream of the crop, and as the third world continues to overbreed we will become more and more on average 'the 1%' or whatever the current slogan is. To be equitable and 'redistribute' we would need to reduce our standards of living to a slightly better version of the current third world standard of living. If you want that then go ahead, nobody is stopping you, but don't expect more than a handful of westerners to follow you iff the cliff to abject poverty in solidarity with the third world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna B Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 We've moved a long way from the original question - Is Corbyn a far left politician? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*_ash_* Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 If you weren't dealing with humans, that would be fine. But you are. With humans, if you disconnect achievement (and thereby effort) from reward, which is what excessive redistribution does, then you lose a lot of productivity. Too little redistribution and you fail to tape into peoples' potential. You want to train people to their full potential and generally look after them properly. That is in everybody's best interests. Too much redistribution and you break the link between effort and reward and too many people do the bare minimum, or nothing at all. Nobody knows where the perfect balance is. It changes. It's different in different cultures. It depends on what other nations are doing. There are generational, regional, and sub-cultural differences within a single nation. You're looking for the sweet spot. That's how you progress fastest and improve the lot of the people most rapidly. The problem I have with Corbyn is that I judge, based largely on the evidence of history and what I see and read about around me, that he's way off on where the sweet spot is. I actually think that he's so far off, that he would not just slow down progress, but reverse it. It's quite clear that too much redistribution and you actually make the recipients of said redistribution worse off. You have to worry about the size of the pie as well as how big everybody's slice is. I also worry about where Corbyn will get his money from. I worry about that a lot. A substantial increase in the basic rate of income tax seems likely (unless he tells me otherwise). Also increases in NI and business taxes which would mean fewer jobs. Then there's the matter of personal allowances and banding. This was the bit I was referring to in earlier post, Read this bit clearly Anna ^^ - The underlined bit is globalisation, and in my opinion in the last few years/decades it has dramatically changed, and far more quickly then any modern/certainly UK politics, has kept up with. We're all just sat here moaning about minor details in the NHS/Police/miliatary etc. when the bigger picture is that UK work is being undercut globally by the day. It has been for at least 40 years, but things are getting much closer to the line now. Look at our taxation to keep this 'modern rich life' going?. The welfare budget, the NHS budget, and the debt is mounting up to such as high scale... the answer more tax? Aren't we paying enough tax already? where is this tax going to come from when the rich stop paying? The budget is completely unsustainable in this country. It can only go down or at best remain as it is. I think we are that weak that so much as a simply a frugal UK Christmas this year could collapse this country - thank goodness we're all out spending our money on cheap far-east clothes, and games machines to just about keep it going get with the picture anna :hihi: The reason people voted in Cameron isn't because they all loved him as you think, or they're all his 'mates'. He's was just the best option to hold up this 'tower of stacked up playing cards' long enough for us to not care about any further ahead. 4-5 years is the going rate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quik Posted January 10, 2016 Author Share Posted January 10, 2016 We've moved a long way from the original question - Is Corbyn a far left politician? It's a poll thread, I'm only interested in the votes, once people have voted they can discuss whatever they want as far as I'm concerned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna B Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 (edited) Most of us on this website are unlikely to be hugely wealthy by UK standards. However by global standards we are all cream of the crop, and as the third world continues to overbreed we will become more and more on average 'the 1%' or whatever the current slogan is. To be equitable and 'redistribute' we would need to reduce our standards of living to a slightly better version of the current third world standard of living. If you want that then go ahead, nobody is stopping you, but don't expect more than a handful of westerners to follow you iff the cliff to abject poverty in solidarity with the third world. Actually, I think that since money is no longer backed by the gold standard and can be created at will, as we discovered with the billions given to bail out the banks, and quantatative easing, etc. I think money is a fairly nebulous concept. I think we're all party to a gigantic con trick perpetrated by the banks and bankers. Real money has lost its meaning. Always enough money for wars and weapons.... ---------- Post added 10-01-2016 at 23:50 ---------- This was the bit I was referring to in earlier post, Read this bit clearly Anna ^^ - The underlined bit is globalisation, and in my opinion in the last few years/decades it has dramatically changed, and far more quickly then any modern/certainly UK politics, has kept up with. We're all just sat here moaning about minor details in the NHS/Police/miliatary etc. when the bigger picture is that UK work is being undercut globally by the day. It has been for at least 40 years, but things are getting much closer to the line now. Look at our taxation to keep this 'modern rich life' going?. The welfare budget, the NHS budget, and the debt is mounting up to such as high scale... the answer more tax? Aren't we paying enough tax already? where is this tax going to come from when the rich stop paying? The budget is completely unsustainable in this country. It can only go down or at best remain as it is. I think we are that weak that so much as a simply a frugal UK Christmas this year could collapse this country - thank goodness we're all out spending our money on cheap far-east clothes, and games machines to just about keep it going get with the picture anna :hihi: The reason people voted in Cameron isn't because they all loved him as you think, or they're all his 'mates'. He's was just the best option to hold up this 'tower of stacked up playing cards' long enough for us to not care about any further ahead. 4-5 years is the going rate I probably agree. We are in a huge mess. And we are dealing with it in highly unsustainable ways. Please see above answer. But then in the long term, Capitalism itself is unsustainable. Edited January 10, 2016 by Anna B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*_ash_* Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Actually, I think that since money is no longer backed by the gold standard and can be created at will, as we discovered with the billions given to bail out the banks, and quantatative easing, etc. I think money is a fairly nebulous concept. I think we're all party to a gigantic con trick perpetrated by the banks and bankers. Real money has lost its meaning. Always enough money for wars and weapons.... ---------- Post added 10-01-2016 at 23:50 ---------- I probably agree. We are in a huge mess. And we are dealing with it in highly unsustainable ways. Please see above answer. But then in the long term, Capitalism itself is unsustainable. It's also inevitable and / or unstoppable. That happens when a population reaches <1 person/community anyway, night Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Arthur Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Actually, I think that since money is no longer backed by the gold standard and can be created at will, as we discovered with the billions given to bail out the banks, and quantatative easing, etc. I think money is a fairly nebulous concept. it isn't nebulous at all. You must have heard of the deficit. But then in the long term, Capitalism itself is unsustainable. Capitalism seems to have worked very well for the last few tens of millennia. When do you predict its demise? ---------- Post added 11-01-2016 at 00:06 ---------- We've moved a long way from the original question - Is Corbyn a far left politician? Two thirds of the people voting on this poll in leftie Sheffield think that Corbyn is a far left politician. There is your answer. Yes he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna B Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 (edited) Two thirds of the people voting on this poll in leftie Sheffield think that Corbyn is a far left politician. There is your answer. Yes he is. No he isn't, they think he's far left. There's a difference. Edited January 11, 2016 by Anna B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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