mattleonard Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 No I see choosing to stand there for a better view as a good metaphor. I shouldn't have to choose a much safer position just because someone might shove me over. It's funny how the brexit camp sees the EU as motivated by pure evil, just wanting to take away our sovereignty, until we leave, at which point they suddenly become our servants, desperate to give us our every whim on a plate. How naive can you get? In or out of the EU, every other country is going to be motivated by its own national interests, rather than ours. As soon as we are out, we will have a much poorer hand when it comes to bargaining. You say you shouldn't have to choose a safer position because someone might shove you over - well it's fine to argue what you shouldn't have to do, but they probably will do. OK, maybe that is a bit of an extreme metaphor. Maybe it's more like being involved in organising a lifeguard station, then saying "this is all too much of a hassle having to work around you lot, I abdicate my responsibility to all of you, but btw, I'm just going to swim out as far as I can; and when I get tired, you'll come and rescue me, yeah?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutty27 Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 It's funny how the brexit camp sees the EU as motivated by pure evil, just wanting to take away our sovereignty, until we leave, at which point they suddenly become our servants, desperate to give us our every whim on a plate. Whats really funny is the fact you think that is what the brexit camps sees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattleonard Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Whats really funny is the fact you think that is what the brexit camps sees. So you don't think they'll give us our whim then? Oh dear, there's no hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutty27 Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 How naive can you get? In or out of the EU, every other country is going to be motivated by its own national interests, rather than ours. As soon as we are out, we will have a much poorer hand when it comes to bargaining. We are in and we can't bargain, we just have to obey, out our bargaining power gets stronger. ---------- Post added 07-03-2016 at 15:39 ---------- So you don't think they'll give us our whim then? Oh dear, there's no hope. What whim do you think that I think they will give us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattleonard Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 We are in and we can't bargain, we just have to obey, out our bargaining power gets stronger. ---------- Post added 07-03-2016 at 15:39 ---------- What whim do you think that I think they will give us? Haha, ask the Norwegians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutty27 Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Haha, ask the Norwegians? They aren't on the forum so I'm asking you, you said in we have bargaining power, explain how we use this bargaining power and what it gets us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattleonard Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 What whim do you think that I think they will give us? For a start, a trade deal comparable with being a member of the bloc. Or do you not think they will give us that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutty27 Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 For a start, a trade deal comparable with being a member of the bloc. Or do you not think they will give us that? I have no idea what our trade deal will look like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattleonard Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 They aren't on the forum so I'm asking you, you said in we have bargaining power, explain how we use this bargaining power and what it gets us. Well, it's quite easy to get their government's opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutty27 Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Well, it's quite easy to get their government's opinion. We are not Norway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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