IDS finally gets his ESA disability benefit cuts

[Stranza]

There is quite a lot of people who are not fraudsters but spongers still.

I'll give you an example.

Late 30s, male, 11 pound per hour job, able bodied.

Lives in newish big house provided by council at discount rate.

Started to work half time because he will get so much in benefits of all sorts that it's more then he gets from working full time.

So instead of making contribution he makes withdrawal.

That money could go to people who are really in need, instead they go to someone who knows how to play the system.

And it's all perfectly legal. You can even get loads of advice how to play same game for free.

Hopefully benefit cuts will move benefits from spongers to people in need.

 

If only it were targeted at the spongers though.

This is disability benefit, so if I've understood it,

A 30 yr old fireman who broke his leg badly (not at work) and couldn't return to firefighting would have to heal, retrain, survive on his contribution based ESA for the first 12 months and then drop down to JSA rate.

 

It could take 2-3 years for him to heal and retrain, he still has the same expenses but cutting his money after 12 months won't speed that up.

Only punish him and push him into debt.

[Mister M]

I'm sure if anyone's got any good ideas about how to magic up the extra tens of billions of pounds needed to run the country without adding to the trillion pound national debt by borrowing it, or making numerous vote losing cuts, or taxing people daft enough to get up and go to work even more, HM government would be only too happy to hear them.

Taxing Starbucks, Facebook, Amazon etc properly would be a start, admitted but billionaires and multi-national companies run off abroad if you hit them too hard then you don't get owt.

 

I would just add that David Cameron said publically, on more than 1 occasion that he "would not balance the books on the backs of the poor".

 

---------- Post added 10-03-2016 at 16:26 ----------

 

There is quite a lot of people who are not fraudsters but spongers still.

I'll give you an example.

Late 30s, male, 11 pound per hour job, able bodied.

Lives in newish big house provided by council at discount rate.

Started to work half time because he will get so much in benefits of all sorts that it's more then he gets from working full time.

So instead of making contribution he makes withdrawal.

That money could go to people who are really in need, instead they go to someone who knows how to play the system.

And it's all perfectly legal. You can even get loads of advice how to play same game for free.

Hopefully benefit cuts will move benefits from spongers to people in need.

 

But that's not how it works - money saved from 'spongers' doesn't automatically go to those in need, as the benefit rates are fixed by central government. I don't think there has ever been a time when a kindly Job Centre staff has taking pity on someone in need & said "you're having a really tough time of it, here have a bit extra this week".

 

---------- Post added 10-03-2016 at 16:30 ----------

 

[/b]

 

Getting the correct tax out of these companies would solve the problem many times over.

 

We have to give them nowhere to run, by making taxes over certain amount a global rate. All these meetings of world leaders at places like Davos and Bilderberg etc could do it in one fell swoop.

 

They won't of course. Too many vested interests and snouts in troughs. Since when were governments about the best interests of the people? Much easier to target the poorest in society who can't fight back, even though it will yield only a drop in the ocean.

---------- Post added 10-03-2016 at 13:21 ----------

 

[/color]

 

The whole system is in chaos thanks to this government's attempt to 'overhaul' benefits. Changing DLA into PIP for no good reason is a perfect example.

 

Indeed - the whole system of the Universal Credit is in chaos; as quoted here:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2637895/A-good-day-ministers-bury-bad-news-IDS-benefits-plan-chaos-classed-failure.html

I deliberately chose a link to a right wing paper, just in case people accused me of quoting from a source naturally hostile to the Tories.

[Bob Arctor]

There is so much rubbish being written on this thread.

 

1. People in the Work Related Activity Group (WRAG) of ESA are not Jobseekers. Along with people in the ESA Support Group, who don't have to do any work related activity, they are deemed as having 'limited capability for work', i.e. they are not work ready. If they were work ready they would be on Jobseekers Allowance (JSA). People on ESA are not jobseekers even by the DWP's definition, so any talk of 'parity between jobseekers' is bogus. The idea is that with 'support' they can get to a point where they are job ready.

 

2. 60% of people in the WRAG remain on ESA for around two years. This reflects the fact that they are not yet ready for work. 60% of people on JSA are on that benefit for around 6 months. There is a huge difference between living on £73.10 a week for 6 months (which in itself is not easy) and living on it for two years. JSA is as low as it is because it is supposed to be a very temporary state of affairs. It is immoral to expect people with life-limiting health conditions to struggle on for two years on this income. Worse, doing so in many cases (particularly for people with mental health conditions) is likely to make peoples' health problems worse, thus pushing them further from the job market.

[Anna B]

That's a very good point. Many of the most vulnerable people in our society are on a cliff edge, and it does seem that the anger over a small number of people who take the **** over rides any feeling of compassion for those at rock bottom.

There will always be people who take the mick, and they should be dealt with. But not at the expense of the vulnerable - it's obscene that many of them have been driven to starvation, illness and suicide.

 

What I want to know is why there isn't the same public outcry over rich and greedy bankers, ("Greedy Bankers dodged tax bill of £100 million" - front page of today's right wing Daily Mail,) as there is about a few of the poorest and most vulnerable people in our society.

 

---------- Post added 12-03-2016 at 11:58 ----------

 

According to today's DM, the Disability benefits bill is to be slashed by £1.2 Billion.

 

'Those affected by cuts to PIP include 640,000 people who need help dressing or undressing or using the bathroom.'

[El Cid]

Some 28,000 families received at least £3,000 too little from 2011-2014 after the Department for Work and Pensions failed to inform the HMRC they were eligible for the extra money.

The families who missed out on payments were those with a disabled child who qualified for Disability Living Allowance and who also receive tax credits - a means-tested top-up for low income households.

 

They should get an extra £3,100 a year or £4,400 a year depending on the severity of the child's disability.

That is a lot of money, both to get and to miss out on. So they get DLA, which is between £20-80 per week, plus this £3,000+ per year; altogether at least £5,000 per year more than ordinary working families.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38113279?SThisFB