National Living Wage.

[gomgeg]

With respect, I imagine your lives were pretty well set up before you retired, in that you already had a fully furnished home, etc.

But a young person is just starting out and their first concern is housing. Without a home they're pretty well stuffed for everything else.

There is a huge housing crisis at the moment, whatever the reason might be. and no signs of it improving any time soon. There is also a jobs crisis in spite of what the government might tell you. Without a job and a home you are pretty well set to shortly become a third world type statistic.

 

It is the young who are going to suffer most, not the established.

Yes we were, after spending 50 years working at any job that would pay the mortgage and feed my family. We and our kids and grandkids were brought up to be self reliant. Employment in the UK is at a record high, education for retraining is available, but unfortunately the dependency culture propagated by the Labour Party is still prevailing.

You really need to see what's going on around. I presume you are about my vintage and just as one example, if our parents had been told that obesity would have been a problem for poor people in the 21st century they would have laughed at us.

[Anna B]

Yes we were, after spending 50 years working at any job that would pay the mortgage and feed my family. We and our kids and grandkids were brought up to be self reliant. Employment in the UK is at a record high, education for retraining is available, but unfortunately the dependency culture propagated by the Labour Party is still prevailing.

You really need to see what's going on around. I presume you are about my vintage and just as one example, if our parents had been told that obesity would have been a problem for poor people in the 21st century they would have laughed at us.

 

I am about your vintage and I expect have had a similar post war life. I also had the same attitudes towards self sufficiency etc, and brought my kids up the same way.

 

Where we part company is in what we believe about the modern world, and in this I have had an education from my children (all very interested in modern politics and social studies,) the internet, the usual kickings life dishes out and and from my work as a volunteer, (including the disabled and homeless,) and believe me it's been a revelation.

 

As an example, we are worlds apart on your assertion that 'Employment in the UK is at a record high.'

I think that is probably nonsense in the sense that you mean it. Statistics can prove or disprove anything depending in which set you use, how you interpret them etc.

Many of those over 50 who find themselves unemployed are not able to get any dole money (too much in savings) and therefore do not feature in the unemployment statistics. There are also nearly a million unemployed on sanctions at any one time who also don't feature in the figures. Then there are those that are working but only part time, and those on 0 hours contracts who cannot claim dole but who might not pick up any hours. Both are classed as employed. And those who are having to work beyond 65 (a growing number) because their pension is inadequate.

 

A better indicator of the number working is productivity which is low, and tax receipts which are not as high as they should be. It doesn't add up. Also unemployment is vastly different in the North, compared with thw South East.

[gomgeg]

I am about your vintage and I expect have had a similar post war life. I also had the same attitudes towards self sufficiency etc, and brought my kids up the same way.

 

Where we part company is in what we believe about the modern world, and in this I have had an education from my children (all very interested in modern politics and social studies,) the internet, the usual kickings life dishes out and and from my work as a volunteer, (including the disabled and homeless,) and believe me it's been a revelation.

 

As an example, we are worlds apart on your assertion that 'Employment in the UK is at a record high.'

I think that is probably nonsense in the sense that you mean it. Statistics can prove or disprove anything depending in which set you use, how you interpret them etc.

Many of those over 50 who find themselves unemployed are not able to get any dole money (too much in savings) and therefore do not feature in the unemployment statistics. There are also nearly a million unemployed on sanctions at any one time who also don't feature in the figures. Then there are those that are working but only part time, and those on 0 hours contracts who cannot claim dole but who might not pick up any hours. Both are classed as employed. And those who are having to work beyond 65 (a growing number) because their pension is inadequate.

 

A better indicator of the number working is productivity which is low, and tax receipts which are not as high as they should be. It doesn't add up. Also unemployment is vastly different in the North, compared with thw South East.

My assertion that employment is at a record high is a fact, whether you choose to believe it or not is irrelevant. We probably both agree that the minimum wage should be higher, I would like to see it at £10 an hour and employers given incentives like reductions in NI contributions etc to pay for it, the reduction in benefit payments would probably pay for it. Where we would disagree is that I would not pay anyone on benefits more than the minimum wage no matter how many kids they've got, then some might show some responsibility. I bet you didn't have more kids than you could afford, we certainly didn't even though we'd loved to have had more. That's what I mean about self responsibility.

As for older people not being able to claim benefits because they have too much savings, isn't that a socialist philosophy?

[spooferman]

According to the Resolution Foundation. 22% of workers in Sheffield will

entitled to the National Living Wage.

Making it the largest city with this %

of workers on the current basic wage.

 

who the hell would get out of bed for that

[GLASGOWOODS]

who the hell would get out of bed for that

 

People who don't mind starting at the bottom and working their way up.

People with a bit of self respect, who don't expect good rates of pay to be delivered straight to their beds.

People who don't rely on others to feed n water them.

[Anna B]

My assertion that employment is at a record high is a fact, whether you choose to believe it or not is irrelevant. We probably both agree that the minimum wage should be higher, I would like to see it at £10 an hour and employers given incentives like reductions in NI contributions etc to pay for it, the reduction in benefit payments would probably pay for it. Where we would disagree is that I would not pay anyone on benefits more than the minimum wage no matter how many kids they've got, then some might show some responsibility. I bet you didn't have more kids than you could afford, we certainly didn't even though we'd loved to have had more. That's what I mean about self responsibility.

As for older people not being able to claim benefits because they have too much savings, isn't that a socialist philosophy?

 

I agree with most of that. And I also think that child benefit should probably be restricted to 2 children.

 

However, how do you know 'Employment is at a record high'? Is it because the government say so? -Well they would, wouldn't they....

 

Lies, Dam lies, and statistics....

Edited April 8, 2016 by Anna B