unbeliever Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 (edited) Who will? The argument is all over the place. Is is possible we're dealing here with a 14 year old who can't put a coherent case together? Edited April 7, 2016 by unbeliever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonzo77 Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 It is soooooo not the same at all: Scenario 1 Woman earns £300,000 per year pays £116368.50 Tax £9271.30 NI Decides to invest in a scheme that means she only earns in effect £250,000 per year Pays £93868.50 Tax £8271.30 NI Scenario 2 Man earns £ 15,000 per year pays £878.00 in tax pays £832.8 NI How can you say they pay the same amount. It is total garbage. Even with the tax avoidance technique, they are contributing to society much much more. If you can't see this, which you can, then there is no hope for you. ---------- Post added 07-04-2016 at 14:20 ---------- Thought I was a toytown tory? Which one is it? The cuts? - like cutting income tax for the least well off? Where did I say they pay the same? Anyway, it's the same scenario, both are playing the system for their own benefit, the scrounger and the millionaire. In my eyes, if you persecute one and support the other, you've got double standards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L00b Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 (edited) Where did I say they pay the same? You didn't, you said: Unfortunately, the more you earn, the more you are supposed to pay in tax. Avoiding this, legally or not, is exactly the same as someone living off the state and contributing nothing.I think you'll find Ron's examples illustrate perfectly well that a bit of variance between one's tax arrangements on an income level of £300k (300/250, resulting in benign avoidance saving a few £k's worth of tax liability) is absolutely not the same as someone living off the state and contributing little to nothing. In my eyes, if you persecute one and support the other, you've got double standards.Who's persecuting one and supporting the other? It's not a judgement on a taxpayer's value. It's an opinion on the fairness of the taxation levels and thresholds applied to those who, objectively, contribute the most. In simple terms, bringing the relevance of the Laffer Curve into the debate. Nobody in their right and fully-functioning mind, whether right- or left-leaning, is suggesting those who earn more should pay the same or less tax, than those who earn less. The debate is about how much more. Edited April 7, 2016 by L00b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 Where did I say they pay the same? Anyway, it's the same scenario, both are playing the system for their own benefit, the scrounger and the millionaire. In my eyes, if you persecute one and support the other, you've got double standards. I'm not saying the person earning £15k is a scrounger. Far from it. But not quite as far from it, as the lady earning £300k. She is so far from being a scrounger, to call her one would be quite mental. Seriously deranged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cid Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 To be fair the thread is about Tax Avoidance, which has transmogrified into evasion. "Cameron's father Ian has amassed a fortune put at £10million." according to the The Mirror newspaper a few months before his death. Ian Cameron made £2million, worth more than £4million today, when the firm sold out to a US bank in the 1986 Big Bang deregulation of the City. In 2007 Ian, who is now retired, and wife Mary sold two paintings by French artist Jean-Baptiste Greuze for £800,000 As an old City hand, he will know how best to minimise payments to the taxman in inheritance tax and pass on as much of his fortune as possible to Cameron, older brother Alex and sisters Tania and Clare. http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/cameron-millions-family-fortunes-tories-206432 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 "Cameron's father Ian has amassed a fortune put at £10million." according to the The Mirror newspaper a few months before his death. Ian Cameron made £2million, worth more than £4million today, when the firm sold out to a US bank in the 1986 Big Bang deregulation of the City. In 2007 Ian, who is now retired, and wife Mary sold two paintings by French artist Jean-Baptiste Greuze for £800,000 As an old City hand, he will know how best to minimise payments to the taxman in inheritance tax and pass on as much of his fortune as possible to Cameron, older brother Alex and sisters Tania and Clare. http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/cameron-millions-family-fortunes-tories-206432 Very sensible thing to do. Minimise death duties. Who wouldn't. ---------- Post added 07-04-2016 at 15:50 ---------- The argument is all over the place. Is is possible we're dealing here with a 14 year old who can't put a coherent case together? I'd like to think my 14 year old would put a better case together than this. If not, I'd have a word with the teacher... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berberis Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 Very sensible thing to do. Minimise death duties. Who wouldn't. I totally agree and by comparison the Royal Family do not pay death duties. Why should the government get 40% of my estate after I have already paid tax on it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxy lady Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 (edited) "Cameron's father Ian has amassed a fortune put at £10million." according to the The Mirror newspaper a few months before his death. Ian Cameron made £2million, worth more than £4million today, when the firm sold out to a US bank in the 1986 Big Bang deregulation of the City. In 2007 Ian, who is now retired, and wife Mary sold two paintings by French artist Jean-Baptiste Greuze for £800,000 As an old City hand, he will know how best to minimise payments to the taxman in inheritance tax and pass on as much of his fortune as possible to Cameron, older brother Alex and sisters Tania and Clare. http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/cameron-millions-family-fortunes-tories-206432 In your rabid desire to point the finger you have clearly missed one fundamental cornerstone of UK tax law. A person can leave their estate or any part of it to their surviving spouse tax free. You do know that Ian Cameron's wife is still alive don't you? So although Iam Cameron could quite easily have left everything except around £325,000 to his wife and paid not a penny in inheritance tax, he chose to leave properties to his children and pay £1 million to the state for the privilige. Edited April 7, 2016 by foxy lady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 In your rabit desire to point the finger you have clearly missed one fundamental cornerstone of UK tax law. A person can leave their estate or any part of it to their surviving spouse tax free. You do know that Ian Cameron's wife is still alive don't you? So although Iam Cameron could quite easily have left everything except around £325,000 to his wife and paid not a penny in inheritance tax, he chose to leave properties to his children and pay £1 million to the state for the privilige. I was assuming she was dead by the way people were talking. It really is even more garbage now!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cid Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 You do know that Ian Cameron's wife is still alive don't you? I believe it was pointed out earlier in the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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