Conservatives in opposition in Scotland

[Berberis]

That's right and probably why we are getting confused

 

It doesn't take much these days

[Ted Heath]

There is another factor in the Tory success in Scotland. Some have realised that if they had voted to become independent they would by now be bankrupt.

 

The Scottish economy is dependent on Oil. A resource that is no longer as important as it once was and the price of which has plummeted since the independence vote.

 

That being the case and seeing the weakness in the SNP argument some, many of them usually centre left Labour supporters, see the Labour party unfit to govern and therefore vote for a centrist Tory government.

 

Labour has a huge job in reinventing itself, bigger actually that the Lib Dems. Unless its leadership starts appealing to voters instead of its loony left members, this once great party is finished.

[unbeliever]

That may be the case; but are the Tories doing that in the country, as a whole?

 

Yes.

 

If not, its down to the changing party loyalties, and not the popularity of the Tories.

Everyone hates the Tories, at least those on the left

 

Everyone meaning you.

 

People ignorant or in denial of the way that economics and real life in general work, hate the Tories.

 

People who deliberately don't earn their keep also hate the Tories.

 

---------- Post added 06-05-2016 at 13:11 ----------

 

There is another factor in the Tory success in Scotland. Some have realised that if they had voted to become independent they would by now be bankrupt.

 

The Scottish economy is dependent on Oil. A resource that is no longer as important as it once was and the price of which has plummeted since the independence vote.

 

That being the case and seeing the weakness in the SNP argument some, many of them usually centre left Labour supporters, see the Labour party unfit to govern and therefore vote for a centrist Tory government.

 

Labour has a huge job in reinventing itself, bigger actually that the Lib Dems. Unless its leadership starts appealing to voters instead of its loony left members, this once great party is finished.

 

It's a self-reinforcing problem for them through isn't it.

Moderates leave, party becomes more radical because of the absence of the moderate voice, so more moderate leave.

[Ted Heath]

Yes.

 

 

 

Everyone meaning you.

 

People ignorant or in denial of the way that economics and real life in general work, hate the Tories.

 

People who deliberately don't earn their keep also hate the Tories.

 

The left hate everything other than themselves. Everyone does not hate the Tories, the ordinary middle of the road voter votes for competence not a party. At this time the Tories are seen as competent, Labour is seen as an inward looking, elitist, bunch of incompetents, led by the worst leader in its history.

 

---------- Post added 06-05-2016 at 13:12 ----------

 

Yes.

 

 

 

Everyone meaning you.

 

People ignorant or in denial of the way that economics and real life in general work, hate the Tories.

 

People who deliberately don't earn their keep also hate the Tories.

 

---------- Post added 06-05-2016 at 13:11 ----------

 

 

It's a self-reinforcing problem for them through isn't it.

Moderates leave, party becomes more radical because of the absence of the moderate voice, so more moderate leave.

 

Absolutely right.

[unbeliever]

The left hate everything other than themselves. Everyone does not hate the Tories, the ordinary middle of the road voter votes for competence not a party. At this time the Tories are seen as competent, Labour is seen as an inward looking, elitist, bunch of incompetents, led by the worst leader in its history.

 

They can be quite a hateful bunch. Being the wrong kind of "left" is just as bad to many. After a while wrong kind of left tends to get re-categorised as a type of right.

 

---------- Post added 06-05-2016 at 13:17 ----------

 

Not in Scotland, its almost enough to make you vote for independence from the South.

 

Same effect. The north could not support itself in the manner to which it's become accustomed without the large wealth transfers from the south it seems blissfully unaware of.

You know what go ahead. I'll move my family down south where we'll get MPs and Councillors who are half-decent and we'll hardly have to pay any tax without the north and Scotland to subsidise.

[GLASGOWOODS]

Yeah, pretty much. Even if Scottish Labour had a left-wing leader like Corbyn, they'd still be losing to the SNP because the SNP are not just left-wing, but also nationalist, and seem to have done a decent enough job in power.

 

As it happens, Scottish Labour don't have a left-wing leader like Corbyn anyway, but a right-wing leader like Kezia Dugdale. But, like I say, I don't think that would make much difference anyway.

 

If you count...

 

The Forth Bridge- balls up.

One force-Police Scotland balls up.

State guardian for every child- Highly unpopular, and challenged in the courts.

School closures- falling to bits (Labour/Libs PFI scheme- less than 10 years old) but, signed off as safe on SNPs watch.

Cash taken away from Colleges (apprentieships) and redirected to SNPs crazy 'free for all,' Uni places. Lovely for those in the European Union.

Just a few here, but many more i'm sure.

[Ms Macbeth]

If you count...

 

The Forth Bridge- balls up.

One force-Police Scotland balls up.

State guardian for every child- Highly unpopular, and challenged in the courts.

School closures- falling to bits (Labour/Libs PFI scheme- less than 10 years old) but, signed off as safe on SNPs watch.

Cash taken away from Colleges (apprentieships) and redirected to SNPs crazy 'free for all,' Uni places. Lovely for those in the European Union.

Just a few here, but many more i'm sure.

 

Good points there. Free prescriptions for all have also come at a cost to other parts of the health service in Scotland (and Wales). The fall in the price of oil must be a huge blow to the SNP.

[foxy lady]

Good points there. Free prescriptions for all have also come at a cost to other parts of the health service in Scotland (and Wales). The fall in the price of oil must be a huge blow to the SNP.

 

It would have been an even bigger blow had Scotland become independent thinking that North Sea oil revenue would support the economy. Total revenue from North Sea oil dropped to a mere £130 million last year, which is why the rest of the UK is funding free education etc north of the border, and presumably making the SNP government look rather better than it actually is.

[I1L2T3]

There is another factor in the Tory success in Scotland. Some have realised that if they had voted to become independent they would by now be bankrupt.

 

The Scottish economy is dependent on Oil. A resource that is no longer as important as it once was and the price of which has plummeted since the independence vote.

 

That being the case and seeing the weakness in the SNP argument some, many of them usually centre left Labour supporters, see the Labour party unfit to govern and therefore vote for a centrist Tory government.

 

Labour has a huge job in reinventing itself, bigger actually that the Lib Dems. Unless its leadership starts appealing to voters instead of its loony left members, this once great party is finished.

 

It shouldn't come as a surprise really. Until the 60s the Tories were very popular in Scotland. The brand of Conservatism in Scotland is recently recognisably different from that at Westminster, with the Tories up there demanding spending increases on all kinds of things. Their manifesto looks mildly left wing and is neatly put together to appeal to the more left wing Scottish electorate. They've done a very slick job and deserve to be in opposition in Scotland.

[andyofborg]

It shouldn't come as a surprise really. Until the 60s the Tories were very popular in Scotland. The brand of Conservatism in Scotland is recently recognisably different from that at Westminster, with the Tories up there demanding spending increases on all kinds of things. Their manifesto looks mildly left wing and is neatly put together to appeal to the more left wing Scottish electorate. They've done a very slick job and deserve to be in opposition in Scotland.

 

a slightly to the left version of that sort one nation, centrist conservatism was what was at the ideological core of blair and his chums new labour revival until it all went to pot.

 

cameron creates the impression that that is where he would like to be but it doesn't seem to work since his more right wing mp's would never stand for it and he's probably too posh to believe it anyway.

 

in scotland, at least, labour are in something of a hole, the snp has been legitamised as a party centre left people can vote for. the scottish conservatives have become something the centre right can vote for. the other centrist parties are getting squashed and the extreme left/right will pick up the non-centrist votes as they always did do.

 

scottish labour seems to be very much in the position the lib dems were in in england before 2010. as long as they dont go too far to the left then they will become the second choice of everyone.

 

their way out is to hope one of the other two parties implodes, which seems unlikely or find a compelling and consistent alternative policy which is both centrist and different to the other two's.