The Rich get richer, much richer1

[hyper]

Pay has never been and isn't supposed to be related to how "hard" you work.

 

I'm paid a lot more than someone digging holes for a living, they work a damn site harder than I do.

by doing that, you are defining hard work as only being physical.

 

There are many working that sit behind a desk all day that have unreasonable deadlines, responsibilities for employees, social responsibilities, financial aspects to manage, customers to manage, meetings to attend where they face hostile questioning, weekends/free time to give up to work that isn't measured on a clocking-in system etc etc

 

Are these people not working hard? - your definition involves only physical hard work, I include mental hard work ... which unfortunately is harder to quantify.

[Cyclone]

No, that was just one example.

 

There are many such people, some of them might even be in this office, and yet despite working harder than me, I get paid more.

This happens because my skills are harder to come by and take longer to learn. It's a supply/demand thing, not a level of effort thing.

But my skills being rare doesn't make my work hard... At least not normally.

 

---------- Post added 09-06-2016 at 13:36 ----------

 

Can you explain why leaving will make the rich even richer?

 

It's unlikely that the economic turmoil that would follow a leave vote will result in the masses somehow benefiting...

The rich at least will insulate themselves from the turmoil, and whilst they might get less rich, the drop for them will be less significant than the millions who will end up unemployed.

[apelike]

It's unlikely that the economic turmoil that would follow a leave vote will result in the masses somehow benefiting...

The rich at least will insulate themselves from the turmoil, and whilst they might get less rich, the drop for them will be less significant than the millions who will end up unemployed.

 

Can you explain why you think millions will end up unemployed?

[Anna B]

Thanks to Cyclone for revealing this aspect of neoliberalism! Cyclone admirably demonstrates the myth that those so-called captains of industry somehow deserve their remuneration.

 

It is also the case that the political class lies when they state that people in work are somehow hard working in order to imply that those who are without work are somehow not hard working. Care workers certainly work very hard for their low wages. Yet they are facing an uncertain future as the care sector begins to fail. Just like the unfortunate BHS employees who face unemployment, we must be sure not to label care workers or anyone else made redundant as shirkers and scroungers simply because the political class and their friends who control business are cynical, exploitative and incompetent or even corrupt, leaving ordinary people without a livelihood, without work.

 

And yet this has been the ultimate Strategy of this Conservative government; to totally demonize and label those in distress, even the disabled, as 'scroungers' to justify the cuts in benefits and services. And a lot of naive people have fallen for it.

 

How hollow does Cameron's 'We're all in this together' mantra sound now...

[Cyclone]

Can you explain why you think millions will end up unemployed?

 

Economic turmoil.

Pound crashing.

Exports fall.

Imports fall.

Inflation reduces the ability to spend.

Interest rates sky rocket, reducing the ability to spend.

Recession hits quickly

Companies make people redundant, or just close entirely

Millions unemployed, millions more unable to pay mortgages.

House market correction finally happens, house prices crash (but nobody except the already rich can benefit).

Government tax receipts fall (by more than we save having left the EU).

Foreign holidays a thing of the past for all but the most wealthy.

 

---------- Post added 10-06-2016 at 07:33 ----------

 

Thanks to Cyclone for revealing this aspect of neoliberalism! Cyclone admirably demonstrates the myth that those so-called captains of industry somehow deserve their remuneration.

 

Can you explain how I demonstrated a myth?

 

With a statement that "pay is not related to how hard you work"?

[RonJeremy]

And yet this has been the ultimate Strategy of this Conservative government; to totally demonize and label those in distress, even the disabled, as 'scroungers' to justify the cuts in benefits and services. And a lot of naive people have fallen for it.

 

How hollow does Cameron's 'We're all in this together' mantra sound now...

 

This is a bold assertion. I believe it is wrong. Please show some evidence that they are demonising those in distress. Can you you show me a quote or something where they have labelled disabled people scroungers.

[Cyclone]

They run constant PR campaigns against people claiming all kinds of benefits. For example, talking about the level of benefit fraud. When you look at the actual numbers, is a trivial amount not worth the attention they're spending on it.

They've also run a PR campaign against the NHS with the intention of demonising the staff and making them appear to be unreasonable all as a prelude to the NHS "failing" which is an excuse to privatise it.

 

They've really taken the mantra of "divide and conquer" to heart.

 

Unfortunately the aspirational working class and a large portion of the less perceptive middle class have fallen for it, they think that a conservative government will act in their favour and make them more well off (and sod everyone else). It's entirely untrue for the majority, the conservatives are in favour of big business and the ultra rich, not the moderately well off middle class or the aspirational but poor.

[Tomjames]

They run constant PR campaigns against people claiming all kinds of benefits. For example, talking about the level of benefit fraud. When you look at the actual numbers, is a trivial amount not worth the attention they're spending on it.

They've also run a PR campaign against the NHS with the intention of demonising the staff and making them appear to be unreasonable all as a prelude to the NHS "failing" which is an excuse to privatise it.

 

They've really taken the mantra of "divide and conquer" to heart.

 

Unfortunately the aspirational working class and a large portion of the less perceptive middle class have fallen for it, they think that a conservative government will act in their favour and make them more well off (and sod everyone else). It's entirely untrue for the majority, the conservatives are in favour of big business and the ultra rich, not the moderately well off middle class or the aspirational but poor.

 

They consistently raise the tax threshold. The middle class keep more of their money.

[truman]

They consistently raise the tax threshold. The middle class keep more of their money.

 

Errr..the point at which you pay tax rises..this means everyone keeps more of their cash..you also may not have noticed but the level at which you start to pay 40% has been lowered so the people paying 40% don't see the increase of tax code..

[Tomjames]

Errr..the point at which you pay tax rises..this means everyone keeps more of their cash..you also may not have noticed but the level at which you start to pay 40% has been lowered so the people paying 40% don't see the increase of tax code..

 

On a typical 50k paye salary:

2014 £36,141

2015 £36,352

2015 £36,465

 

Looks like it's going up to me.