*_ash_* Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 Very cute Ash, now why don't you try and explain how people's quality of life has been reduced, beginning with you. I hear too many people claiming this without evidence, why don't you decide to be the first. But be assured, I hope you sleep on it. Get this bit right, and then we can move on. You generalise by using 'peoples' - when you actually said 'nobody' is affected. There is a big difference. All your 'evidence' are averages over the country. However, saying words like 'Nobody', suggests that because the average, or mean, or median figures suggest positive overall, that no one loses out. This is nonsense, and if you worked in the field these days, you'd not need to look things up on statistics pages to suit your agenda. Very cute Ash, now why don't you try and explain how people's quality of life has been reduced, beginning with you. I hear too many people claiming this without evidence, why don't you decide to be the first. But be assured, I hope you sleep on it. Away from stats sites, we can't really 'link' real life experience can we? But I'll be the first just for you Tim. I'll show you a link of what individual people think to whether they are better or worse off. Link ---------- Post added 21-07-2016 at 23:15 ---------- Ah..not so fast. The Brexiters were also warning of Armageddon, predicting certain collapse of the EU. Get the point now? This was my stance, and was from well before the debates. I watched all of them, and this wasn't mentioned more than once in ANY of them. I only recalled one person saying it, because I remember agreeing with them. Who were these brexiters warning of armageddon and collapse of the EU? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Joker Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 I can't remember seeing the wording on the bus, but I remember seeing it on the news. <snip> You can interpret that wording as you want. We send 350m to the EU every week Let's fund NHS instead. Vote Leave. Is that a promise of 350 million into the NHS? I think most people 'who voted based on that bus' probably had made their mind up already. "Let's fund our NHS instead." What kind of stupid statement is that? We already do fund our NHS. To the tune of £2billion a week. And you seriously wonder why Remainers think Brexiters are thick? Perhaps you should instead be asking why the two cowards BoJo and Our Nige' realised they couldn't contain the beast they had created, and quit both their prime-ministerial ambitions and resigned as head of their party respectively, within days of the Brexit vote? On the bright side, I'm looking to some witty comments by BoJo now he's Foreign Secretary. Since I don't subscribe to Amazon Prime, so in the absence of Top Gear's Jezza, I'll have to rely on BoJo to insult foreign dignitaries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxy lady Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 Ah..not so fast. The Brexiters were also warning of Armageddon, predicting certain collapse of the EU. Get the point now? It would seem the Guardian still is. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/24/brexit-britain-disintegrating-eu-yanis-varoufakis and so is George Soros. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36630468 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*_ash_* Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 "Let's fund our NHS instead." What kind of stupid statement is that? I don't know!... who the heck looks to bus adverts to lead their lives, and influences their decisions? I spend so much of my life stuck in traffic behind those new green buses that say '100% FREE WIFI', that I wonder who really believes or works how stupid that is? And you seriously wonder why Remainers think Brexiters are thick? I don't wonder at all. I just think so many more remainers than brexiters have proven that they're hypocrites of the worst kind. Most of the remainer side who post on social media and here, are people who are anti-racist posters, who criticise the nonsense that racism is (rightly so), by pointing out their judging of an entire group based on a few, is nonsense - and yet here they all are in their glory doing exactly the same thing, like this post of yours Joker! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Yes please, the sooner the better We do nearly half our trade with them so be careful what you wish for ---------- Post added 22-07-2016 at 05:19 ---------- Get this bit right, and then we can move on. You generalise by using 'peoples' - when you actually said 'nobody' is affected. There is a big difference. All your 'evidence' are averages over the country. However, saying words like 'Nobody', suggests that because the average, or mean, or median figures suggest positive overall, that no one loses out. This is nonsense, and if you worked in the field these days, you'd not need to look things up on statistics pages to suit your agenda. Away from stats sites, we can't really 'link' real life experience can we? But I'll be the first just for you Tim. I'll show you a link of what individual people think to whether they are better or worse off. Link ---------- Post added 21-07-2016 at 23:15 ---------- This was my stance, and was from well before the debates. I watched all of them, and this wasn't mentioned more than once in ANY of them. I only recalled one person saying it, because I remember agreeing with them. Who were these brexiters warning of armageddon and collapse of the EU? Who were they? Practically every Brexiter on this forum and every other forum I looked at. There were also stories in the media about warnings of at least the Eurozone collapsing and comment pages on media sites were festooned with the argument. More risky to stay in we were told. Leadsom used the argument. And it also formed the core of articles in newspapers: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/05/07/never-mind-brexit-risks--to-stay-in-eu-is-a-bigger-danger/ Have you been hiding under a rock? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tzijlstra Posted July 22, 2016 Author Share Posted July 22, 2016 Get this bit right, and then we can move on. You generalise by using 'peoples' - when you actually said 'nobody' is affected. There is a big difference. All your 'evidence' are averages over the country. However, saying words like 'Nobody', suggests that because the average, or mean, or median figures suggest positive overall, that no one loses out. This is nonsense, and if you worked in the field these days, you'd not need to look things up on statistics pages to suit your agenda. Away from stats sites, we can't really 'link' real life experience can we? But I'll be the first just for you Tim. I'll show you a link of what individual people think to whether they are better or worse off. Link. My word, how much can you run from a simple question? It is exactly this head-in-sand behaviour that makes people 'believe' that they have bad lives. That is exactly my point and I'd still like to see you answer how YOU have been affected negatively. Let me also make clear, the use of nobody was an exaggeration, but in history there has never been a period of time where everybody was happy. It is simply impossible. You don't need to 'make it real' for me Ash, I know people who quite happily spout racist nonsense in my presence, when I ask them how they are affected they can't tell me. Very few people actually can, take our friend Penistone, vehemently against immigration, yet lives in a lovely green valley according to himself. Nimbyism doesn't even come close to it, it is even more pathetic than that. Finally, you are a Brexiteer, so I am going to generalise you potentially, although I am fairly certain you too have stated that the Leave vote wasn't about immigration, yet here you are peddling the outcome of the referendum in my face when I ask how YOU are affected by EU immigration. Hypocrite or simply unable to answer? I suspect the latter. ---------- Post added 22-07-2016 at 08:21 ---------- It would seem the Guardian still is. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/24/brexit-britain-disintegrating-eu-yanis-varoufakis and so is George Soros. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36630468 An opinion piece by a practical communist and a forecast by a man who predicted economic doom before the referendum and whom you happily dismissed at that point. Serves you well cherry-picking selective reports, doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxy lady Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 (edited) An opinion piece by a practical communist and a forecast by a man who predicted economic doom before the referendum and whom you happily dismissed at that point. Serves you well cherry-picking selective reports, doesn't it? Actually this entire thread is nothing but opinion pieces. Mostly your opinions I note. Because we voted to leave the EU and so far not much has happened. But then you were predicting doom for the UK before the referendum. It hasn't happened and won't happen regardless of how much of your life you devote to the topic. Edited July 22, 2016 by foxy lady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tzijlstra Posted July 22, 2016 Author Share Posted July 22, 2016 Actually this entire thread is nothing but opinion pieces. Mostly your opinions I note. Because we voted to leave the EU and so far not much has happened. But then you were predicting doom for the UK before the referendum. It hasn't happened. As were Soros and Varoufakis, which you now duly use to propel your own opinion. Isn't debating fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magilla Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Interesting I also heard all the remainers on the debate programmes claiming that the NHS would be finished if we vote out. Let's see how that pans out. So far, that is a lie. So far, we haven't left the EU! However, even the most conserative estimates put the NHS losing more than double our EU contribution:- http://www.health.org.uk/publication/nhs-finances-outside-eu Which I guess is why the government proposed an inquiry into moving to a "pay NHS" after the vote:- https://www.opendemocracy.net/ournhs/richard-grimes/government-moves-to-consider-nhs-user-charges The NHS has also said that people should expect a lower standard of care going forward. With that in mind, to suggest the predictions were a lie is fanciful at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alhlkh Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Why would it be? Any access the the single market relies on the free movement of people from within the EU, unless as stated the EU caves on that, which looks unlikely. Other migration was already controllable. Access to the single market isn't dependant on the free movement of people, but it does appear for now that membership of the single market is dependant on the free movement of people, so we will be able to trade within it without being a member of it, just like most countries that trade within it without being members of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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