unbeliever Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 A little forum search may be in order, as I distinctly remember your lack of courtesy in some of your replies to my earlier posts. Incidentally, I did not challenge you on matters of courtesy, I called your cop-out for what it is: your failing entirely to address the substance and point of the post to which you were replying. Just like you completely avoided the substance and point of the two preceding posts. Mock offence and complete mutism about uncomfortable questions. You're not fooling anyone, u. It's just a shame that you're choosing to try and lay it on thicker instead. Now you see when my courtesy was challenged I apologised and we moved on. You instead have chosen to just keep digging and if anything escalate matters. I've spend this entire thread engaging on the issues as is plain to see. I am now making a stand on courtesy. Once this is settled we can return to the points you made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L00b Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 I've spend this entire thread engaging on the issues as is plain to see. I am now making a stand on courtesy. Once this is settled we can return to the points you made.OK Big bag of tariff money and businesses moving from the EU to the UK to access our internal market. HaHaHaHaHaHaHa That was good, u Now, come on, seriously. You said if the EU doesn't take what deal the UK offers (this I what I understand by "belligerent and reject the offer"; am I correct?), they'll suffer more (LOL!) and there will be "many compensations" for the UK. You've been explained sideways and lengthways about the elasticity of supply and demand prices, so much in goods as in services, between EU member states. When manufacturers, wholesalers and financiers have been scouting to relocate (and in some cases already begun to relocate) in Dublin, Paris and Frankfurt, what on earth makes you think others are going to come here to the tune of the current pre-actual Brexit economical activity? PS - posts #4993 and #4999 as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 OK HaHaHaHaHaHaHa That was good, u Now, come on, seriously. You said if the EU doesn't take what deal the UK offers (this I what I understand by "belligerent and reject the offer"; am I correct?), they'll suffer more (LOL!) and there will be "many compensations" for the UK. You've been explained sideways and lengthways about the elasticity of supply and demand prices, so much in goods as in services, between EU member states. When manufacturers, wholesalers and financiers have been scouting to relocate (and in some cases already begun to relocate) in Dublin, Paris and Frankfurt, what on earth makes you think others are going to come here to the tune of the current pre-actual Brexit economical activity? PS - posts #4993 and #4999 as well I've already mentioned the compensations. Netting tariff money, businesses locating in the UK in order to access the UK's internal market. I don't see why you think there would more relocating from the UK than to it. I'm not sure whether the UK and/or the EU will be better off once the trauma of the Brexit process has run its course. I'm very confident that it won't make a huge difference in the medium term. In the long term I think the European project will fail and I prefer not to be attached to it when it does. It's patently obvious that since the EU operates a surplus with the UK that if said trade is reduced as a result of barriers then they lose more. As I keep saying, the economic case is secondary to the matter of sovereignty for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Because the EU is a much bigger market. And won't be suffering a massive economic hit/depression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 (edited) Because the EU is a much bigger market. Yes it is. About 4 to 4.5 times bigger measured by GDP. But that normalises out surely. ---------- Post added 17-10-2016 at 17:24 ---------- And won't be suffering a massive economic hit/depression. Which has yet to materialise despite all the emphatic predictions from, for example, the Treasury that it would immediately after the vote. The economy is growing, despite the best efforts of some to talk it down. Edited October 17, 2016 by unbeliever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 As I keep saying, the economic case is secondary to the matter of sovereignty for me. I can't understand what sovereignty you think we've regained. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 I can't understand what sovereignty you think we've regained. Once we actually leave, the power to set our own laws and policy. That's what sovereignty is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 We were participating in a group which we had at least an proportional say in (probably greater than we should to be honest), by which we set laws as a group. It's sovereignty on a bigger scale. By leaving we will have no say in the laws that the EU passes, but may well be obliged to adhere to them anyway if we want to trade within the single market. That's your sovereignty. You've given up proposing the laws, and having a vote on the laws, to simply HAVING to follow them or be frozen out of the trade block. The fact that you suggest that this is what we've regained rather suggests that you've swallowed the propaganda about the EU (as if we weren't part of it) imposing laws on us... They've done some pretty terrible things though haven't they. Human Rights laws, employment laws, terrible stuff. What law are you looking forward to being repealed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 We were participating in a group which we had at least an proportional say in (probably greater than we should to be honest), by which we set laws as a group. It's sovereignty on a bigger scale. By leaving we will have no say in the laws that the EU passes, but may well be obliged to adhere to them anyway if we want to trade within the single market. That's your sovereignty. You've given up proposing the laws, and having a vote on the laws, to simply HAVING to follow them or be frozen out of the trade block. The fact that you suggest that this is what we've regained rather suggests that you've swallowed the propaganda about the EU (as if we weren't part of it) imposing laws on us... They've done some pretty terrible things though haven't they. Human Rights laws, employment laws, terrible stuff. What law are you looking forward to being repealed? We've been rather leading the way with employment law so that's not really a thing. We have no say in US law, but we're affected by it through trade. I've answered this before, but personally I don't like the energy laws and I also have an issue with the farming subsidies. That's off the top of my head, but I can provide more. I find the EU to be over-regulatory and corporatist, and I would like policy set without so much corporate influence. I might have been convinced if the EU was a functioning democracy. But it isn't. And I see no indication that it will become one. In a functioning democracy, you get big changes in policy following a major change in the vote at an election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cid Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 I've answered this before, but personally I don't like the energy laws and I also have an issue with the farming subsidies. That's off the top of my head, but I can provide more. I find the EU to be over-regulatory and corporatist, and I would like policy set without so much corporate influence. I thought the UK led the way in climate change, and reducing CO2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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