Lex Luthor Posted June 30, 2016 Author Share Posted June 30, 2016 Get Brexit to come within a hair of winning then, as the Tory party figurehead, commandeer the leadership of the Tory Eurosceptic contingent and, as 'Boris' out-populising Farage, commandeer the adulation of the UKIP contingent. Then step into Cameron's shoes come 2020 or earlier. Sounds like a possible plausible explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 Maybe Heseltine was on the money; we get a new PM, but Boris, who got us into this mess, is the one that goes to negotiate with Brussels. Then we have a referendum to see if we like what he's got us. If not, stay in the EU as was. ---------- Post added 30-06-2016 at 13:49 ---------- He said he wouldn't stand for a start. That's not a referendum campaign promise and he did all he could to find somebody else suitable for the job. Anything else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz1 Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 Gove knows exactly what he wants out of Brexit. So do many others. I'm sure they do but this was not a result which was expected- hence very little plan going ahead. They will need to come out with a plan- one that has to suit the UK as a whole Maybe I missed intricate details on this aspect, exactly who has outlined their proposal for Brexit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 I'm sure they do but this was not a result which was expected- hence very little plan going ahead. They will need to come out with a plan- one that has to suit the UK as a whole Maybe I missed intricate details on this aspect, exactly who has outlined their proposal for Brexit. Various people. Take a look for example at John Redwood's site. There was obviously no leave consensus on the best arrangements following a leave vote. The government could have prepared and presented an alternative plan, but they chose not to as the uncertainly improved their chances of getting a remain win. Now if Gove wins the Conservative leadership, his plans (which I think you'll find look an awful lot like Redwood's) will take the lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radan Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 (edited) That's not a referendum campaign promise and he did all he could to find somebody else suitable for the job. Anything else? He rode the big lying bus. He brought his dad into the debate then complained when journos checked the facts. He's a failed education secretary. Why should he care what Paul Dacre and Rupert Murdoch think? Grubby..... May would be better. That enough? Edited June 30, 2016 by Radan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 He rode the big lying bus. I didn't like that but he defended it admirably. He brought his dad into the debate then complained when journos checked the facts. The facts are as he stated. The Journos conned his 79 year old Dad into saying things he didn't mean He's a failed education secretary. He had good ideas, but wasn't able to get them all through. At least he tried. Why should he care what Paul Dacre and Rupert Murdoch think? Grubby..... Lives in the real world, but still has principles. May would be better. No chance. That enough? Nowhere near. This was supposed to be about promises made in the referendum campaign which have since been withdrawn. What you have instead presented is a general critique of Gove. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radan Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 I didn't like that but he defended it admirably. The facts are as he stated. The Journos conned his 79 year old Dad into saying things he didn't mean He had good ideas, but wasn't able to get them all through. At least he tried. Lives in the real world, but still has principles. No chance. Nowhere near. This was supposed to be about promises made in the referendum campaign which have since been withdrawn. What you have instead presented is a general critique of Gove. Meh, I will continue my critique. For some reason the government seems to think he is an authority figure in Islamic terrorism. He's not. He wrote a book about it which was widely ridiculed by people that actually know what they are talking about. He's generally a slimy little worm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 Meh, I will continue my critique. For some reason the government seems to think he is an authority figure in Islamic terrorism. He's not. He wrote a book about it which was widely ridiculed by people that actually know what they are talking about. He's generally a slimy little worm. I've read that book. You should check it out. I've also read various other books on the subject. I'm sure it's no problem to find experts to tear his ideas apart. I couldn't find a single thing to disagree with myself, but then I don't claim to be an expert. The central point is that appeasement makes things worse as it shows weakness. As far as I can tell, all the evidence of history supports this. A lot of the experts are rather fond of appeasement. It's nowhere near anti-Islamic if that's what you're worried about. It makes a clear and consistent distinction between Islamists and Muslims in general. May thinks that the solution to Islamism is to merge sharia law into the UK statutes, so I know who I trust on such matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radan Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 (edited) I've read that book. You should check it out. I've also read various other books on the subject. I'm sure it's no problem to find experts to tear his ideas apart. I couldn't find a single thing to disagree with myself, but then I don't claim to be an expert. The central point is that appeasement makes things worse as it shows weakness. As far as I can tell, all the evidence of history supports this. A lot of the experts are rather fond of appeasement. May thinks that the solution to Islamism is to merge sharia law into the UK statutes, so I know who I trust on such matters. So he talks big? But looks so feeble. His book was widely derided, but Melanie Philips defended it, her of Londonistan fame. Should tell you what you need to know there. Source for your claim about May? Edited June 30, 2016 by Radan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbeliever Posted June 30, 2016 Share Posted June 30, 2016 (edited) So he talks big? But looks so feeble. His book was widely derided, but Melanie Philips defended it, her of Londonistan fame. Should tell you what you need to know there. I think I learned more about the book from reading the book that you did from reading what loud people said about it. It's not terribly long. Read it in a day. In case you don't remember, it's called "Celsius 7/7". Honestly, check it out. I couldn't care less what you think he looks like. Nobody could mistake him for feeble when he speaks. Source for your claim about May? Just google "may sharia law". ---------- Post added 30-06-2016 at 14:27 ---------- You know you're not doing the general muslim world any favours by appeasing Islamists. Not unless you think they benefit from being ruled by brutal nutters. Edited June 30, 2016 by unbeliever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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