Who will replace Labour as the main "progressive" voice in parliament?

[pacifica]

Owen Smith hasn't managed even a handful

 

I do find it wonderful how supposedly labour supporters will attack their own and not be bright enough to realise what they are doing.

 

---------- Post added 19-09-2016 at 08:47 ----------

 

And you know this because.....?

Where is your evidence?

 

Is it because you say so, and people do what they're told, if they're told it often enough.... because it didn't seem to work with Brexit, did it?

 

Realistically, the only way to find out for sure is in an election, and that's some time away. A lot can happen before then.

 

You don't seem to understand that the world has undergone a critical change since the banking crisis. People don't forget, they know a lot more than they used to, and they no longer trust the establishment. They're fed up to the back teeth with the old system and are looking for change.

 

I am a moderate. I know from experience that many Jeremy Corbyn supporters are moderates.And there are an awful lot of them. Not militant, not Marxist, not Momentum, just ordinary. But we are sick of being unheard and sh** on from a great height.

 

Rather than wasting your time disparaging Jeremy Corbyn, you'd better hope that Theresa May shapes up to do some of the things required, like leveling the playing field, and reintroducing some integrity. She could start with the Bankers and big Corporations. You never know, she could even try getting them to pay their tax!

 

http://www.theweek.co.uk/labour-leadership-election/74344/labour-leadership-election-polls-and-odds-will-debate-have-an/page/0/2

 

Millions of Labour voters prefer May to Corbyn

 

10 August 2016

 

Millions of Labour supporters would vote for the Conservative Party's Theresa May over Jeremy Corbyn, a new poll has revealed.

 

The survey, conducted by YouGov for The Times, showed that 29 per cent of people who voted for the party in the last general election would now back May over the embattled Labour leader. This equates to 2.7 million Labour voters out of a total 9.3 million.

 

So what evidence do you have that they will?

Edited September 19, 2016 by pacifica

[unbeliever]

 

http://www.theweek.co.uk/labour-leadership-election/74344/labour-leadership-election-polls-and-odds-will-debate-have-an/page/0/2

 

Millions of Labour voters prefer May to Corbyn

 

10 August 2016

 

Millions of Labour supporters would vote for the Conservative Party's Theresa May over Jeremy Corbyn, a new poll has revealed.

 

The survey, conducted by YouGov for The Times, showed that 29 per cent of people who voted for the party in the last general election would now back May over the embattled Labour leader. This equates to 2.7 million Labour voters out of a total 9.3 million.

 

So what evidence do you have that they will?

 

Wow that's even worse than I thought.

So about 2 thirds of the electors who supported Labour will do so again in 2020.

 

Now you'd think that this would lead to them losing dozens of seats and handing the Conservatives a massive victory, but apparently some kind of magic will come in to play and because the few remaining people who vote for Corbyn's Labour will do so with such joy in their hearts they'll somehow win the election anyway.

[El Cid]

The survey, conducted by YouGov for The Times, showed that 29 per cent of people who voted for the party in the last general election would now back May over the embattled Labour leader. This equates to 2.7 million Labour voters out of a total 9.3 million.

 

So what evidence do you have that they will?

 

There are 45 million potential voters in the UK, all potential Labour, Conservative, Liberal Democrat ..... voters.

[unbeliever]

There are 45 million potential voters in the UK, all potential Labour, Conservative, Liberal Democrat ..... voters.

 

That's not how it works in the real world.

[pacifica]

Wow that's even worse than I thought.

So about 2 thirds of the electors who supported Labour will do so again in 2020.

 

Now you'd think that this would lead to them losing dozens of seats and handing the Conservatives a massive victory, but apparently some kind of magic will come in to play and because the few remaining people who vote for Corbyn's Labour will do so with such joy in their hearts they'll somehow win the election anyway.

 

That doesn't include the ones who would vote libdem, UKIP or Green. But at the last election 11,334,000 voted tory compared to 9,347,000 who voted labour. If 2.7 million did defect that would be tory 14,034,000 to labour 6,647,000. In other words the tories would have way more that double the labour vote and the innocents can't see it coming.

[unbeliever]

That doesn't include the ones who would vote libdem, UKIP or Green. But at the last election 11,334,000 voted tory compared to 9,347,000 who voted labour. If 2.7 million did defect that would be tory 14,034,000 to labour 6,647,000. In other words the tories would have way more that double the labour vote and the innocents can't see it coming.

 

I really don't know what they're playing at. I suspect they want to tear down British Socialism so that they can build it back up again in a way that suits them better.

 

I don't think the electoral balance has ever been this far out before.

Perhaps this is just what it looks like when a giant of politics like Labour dies.

Edited September 19, 2016 by unbeliever

[pacifica]

I really don't know what they're playing at. I suspect they want to tear down British Socialism so that they can build it back up again in a way that suits them better.

 

I don't think the electoral balance has ever been this far out before.

Perhaps this is just what it looks like when a giant of politics like Labour dies.

 

The important thing, as many labour voters know, is to keep corbin and his policies away from government. It is well worth voting against a life long held believe to avoid destroying it. I certainly would if a corbin, a trump, a powell or a galloway was dictating policy.

[unbeliever]

The important thing, as many labour voters know, is to keep corbin and his policies away from government. It is well worth voting against a life long held believe to avoid destroying it. I certainly would if a corbin, a trump, a powell or a galloway was dictating policy.

 

Perhaps that's how we explain it to them.

Moderates won't vote for Corbyn or Galloway any more than they would Trump.

Myself if faced with such a choice I'd either vote for a no-hoper or spoil my ballot.

[tinfoilhat]

Perhaps that's how we explain it to them.

Moderates won't vote for Corbyn or Galloway any more than they would Trump.

Myself if faced with such a choice I'd either vote for a no-hoper or spoil my ballot.

 

But if you look at why trump and corbyn are doing as well as they are (and the former is a coughing fit away from the white house as it stands) its because they are likely to get people to who don't vote ("cause theyre all the same") and will buy into populist politics.

[unbeliever]

But if you look at why trump and corbyn are doing as well as they are (and the former is a coughing fit away from the white house as it stands) its because they are likely to get people to who don't vote ("cause theyre all the same") and will buy into populist politics.

 

Corbyn is not doing well, and UK politics is nowhere near as radically "left" as the US is radically "right".

Corbyn's tried to play the "I'm not one of them" card. It hasn't worked on the vast majority of us. He is in fact one of them and it's rather straightforward to demonstrate as much.

 

I was comparing Corbyn's chances in the UK with the hypothetical of Trump running in the UK.

In the US, Corbyn would be out on the street wearing a cardboard sign.