El Cid Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Well you could shut all bars down and have no crime. A web site with data like that would be rather simplistic and there may be several reasons why a crime might have ocurred. You should also see it in prespective and context. It actually gives the type of crime. Maybe this is it? http://www.crime-statistics.co.uk/postcode ---------- Post added 03-10-2016 at 21:41 ---------- This ..... https://www.police.uk/south-yorkshire/BD3/crime/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Do we really need to have such late closing hours given the problems it has created? It's this kind of anecdote to generalisation that makes it difficult to have serious discussions on the forum. You've taken a single example and then extrapolated it into a general problem with no evidence at all, nor consideration of the trouble that used to occur when everywhere chucked out at the same time. As if it's easier to police the city centre with 5000 people all kicked out drunk at the same time, rather than coming out over the space of 4 or 5 hours... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crookedspire Posted October 3, 2016 Author Share Posted October 3, 2016 Yeah but you won't find anything new. You can go back to the first time beer was brewed and you'll find one Sumerian* telling another he was his best mate before he nutted a stranger. Alcohol related violence is as old as time and we take to the highest level on a weekend in this country. *google it like I had to. Pubs in the past didn't open until wee hours . In the Victorian age they opened when they wanted too but closed by midnight this change in the Great War by Lloyd George as he realised that drunk workers in bomb factories didn't mix. The old hours were 11am to 3pm then opened again at 6pm closed at 10pm though different areas might have granted an extra half hour . The hours were change again not sure what year to 11am to 11pm and it stayed that way for some years before these free for all hours we now have. Yes their always been the drunk who is keen with his fists but usually the regulars sorted it out and all was forgot landlords in the past basically were given free reign to sort out trouble makers out in fact some Chesterfield landlords were ex boxers . The hours are far too long we don't have the Police now nor any old school no messing landlords in any pubs or clubs. ---------- Post added 03-10-2016 at 22:22 ---------- It's this kind of anecdote to generalisation that makes it difficult to have serious discussions on the forum. You've taken a single example and then extrapolated it into a general problem with no evidence at all, nor consideration of the trouble that used to occur when everywhere chucked out at the same time. As if it's easier to police the city centre with 5000 people all kicked out drunk at the same time, rather than coming out over the space of 4 or 5 hours... OK then come to Chesterfield at the weekend stay too the late hours these bars are open too see for yourself the problems its causing . Their is no generalization here only fact but sadly has seen a death of a young man his family have a point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
999tigger Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 (edited) Pubs in the past didn't open until wee hours . In the Victorian age they opened when they wanted too but closed by midnight this change in the Great War by Lloyd George as he realised that drunk workers in bomb factories didn't mix. The old hours were 11am to 3pm then opened again at 6pm closed at 10pm though different areas might have granted an extra half hour . The hours were change again not sure what year to 11am to 11pm and it stayed that way for some years before these free for all hours we now have. Yes their always been the drunk who is keen with his fists but usually the regulars sorted it out and all was forgot landlords in the past basically were given free reign to sort out trouble makers out in fact some Chesterfield landlords were ex boxers . The hours are far too long we don't have the Police now nor any old school no messing landlords in any pubs or clubs. ---------- Post added 03-10-2016 at 22:22 ---------- OK then come to Chesterfield at the weekend stay too the late hours these bars are open too see for yourself the problems its causing . Their is no generalization here only fact but sadly has seen a death of a young man his family have a point. Do you want to go back to good old Victorian times? You cna read all about the impact or not of the Licencing Act 2003 here https://gallery.mailchimp.com/708e119fa74cd33e6a28f949a/files/Briefing_1505_Drinking_fast_and_slow_web.pdf Edited October 3, 2016 by 999tigger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crookedspire Posted October 3, 2016 Author Share Posted October 3, 2016 Do you want to go back to good old Victorian times? Don't talk daft mate, what I'm saying is what was wrong with 11am to 11pm you can only drink so much if you can't get your fill in them hours you must have a right problem . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikki-red Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Don't talk daft mate, what I'm saying is what was wrong with 11am to 11pm you can only drink so much if you can't get your fill in them hours you must have a right problem . The longer opening hours arent about enabling people to drink for longer, people work lots of different shifts/hours now, the longer opening hours mean people doing for example a 2-10 could still go for a few drinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
999tigger Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 (edited) Don't talk daft mate, what I'm saying is what was wrong with 11am to 11pm you can only drink so much if you can't get your fill in them hours you must have a right problem . It was about evening out the binge drinking so people didnt do the last order rush and you didnt have hundreds/ thousands on the street at the same time. Short memory if you cnat remember the chaos at chucking out time. https://gallery.mailchimp.com/708e119fa74cd33e6a28f949a/files/Briefing_1505_Drinking_fast_and_slow_web.pdf So the result seems to be that violent crime and alsohol related violent crime has fallen by 53% in the last ten years. It was falling anyway because people drink less. later hours have not caused an increase in such crime. Its probably smoothed out the time of any trouble more evenly rather than focusing on certain hours. Edited October 3, 2016 by 999tigger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Don't talk daft mate, what I'm saying is what was wrong with 11am to 11pm you can only drink so much if you can't get your fill in them hours you must have a right problem . In world war 1, lots was wrong with it - that's why they introduced lunchtime opening hours and evening opening hours. Chesterfield, because of the density of its pubs has always been a bit feisty. I recall a conversation with a chap whose prime drinking age would have taken him to around the 1970s who told me that on a Saturday night it would have been an event had there not been fisty cuffs under the vic veranda. I was a regular visitor to Chesterfield hostelries in the 1990s. It could kick off at 10.30 over a kebab queue. My work takes to me places where drinking starts at 7 and finishes around 5. Very very little violence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
999tigger Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 It actually gives the type of crime. Maybe this is it? http://www.crime-statistics.co.uk/postcode ---------- Post added 03-10-2016 at 21:41 ---------- This ..... https://www.police.uk/south-yorkshire/BD3/crime/ Pretty useless what you need is actual analysis over time. That just gives monthly reported crimes, not even convictions. A lot of them cant even be mapped. The research shows that the effect of the Licencing Act has been pretty neutral on crime levels. Ciolent crime and as a result alcohol related violenet crime has fallen by 53% in the last ten years, althought its not expected that ucch of this has to do with the Licencing Act. What can be said is its not made things any worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 OK then come to Chesterfield at the weekend stay too the late hours these bars are open too see for yourself the problems its causing . Their is no generalization here only fact but sadly has seen a death of a young man his family have a point. How will this prove that it's worse than it was in the past? ---------- Post added 04-10-2016 at 07:27 ---------- Don't talk daft mate, what I'm saying is what was wrong with 11am to 11pm you can only drink so much if you can't get your fill in them hours you must have a right problem . You'll notice that on a Friday (for example) many people work, and then want dinner. So the drinking and socialising can't start until something like 1900. ---------- Post added 04-10-2016 at 07:28 ---------- So the result seems to be that violent crime and alsohol related violent crime has fallen by 53% in the last ten years. It was falling anyway because people drink less. later hours have not caused an increase in such crime. Its probably smoothed out the time of any trouble more evenly rather than focusing on certain hours. And this was my point about why an anecdote or series of anecdotes is a very poor basis for an argument. The real facts show the complete opposite to what the OP suggested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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